Press Release: Atheists: Nobody Needs Christ at Christmas

Times Square Billboards Urge Celebration of Family, Friends

Manhattan, NY—American Atheists launched a major billboard display on Tuesday that declares Christmas is better without the Christ. The huge 40′x40′ digital billboard is located in Times Square in Midtown Manhattan. Using motion graphics, the billboard proclaims, “Who needs Christ during Christmas?” A hand crosses out the word “Christ” and the word “NOBODY” appears. The display then says “Celebrate the true meaning of Xmas” and offers a series of cheery words: family, friends, charity, food, snow, and more. The commercial ends with a jovial “Happy Holidays!” from American Atheists and displays the organization’s website, atheists.org.“This season is a great time of year for a hundred reasons—none of them having to do with religion,” said American Atheists President David Silverman. “This year, start a new tradition: Don’t go to church. You hate it, it’s boring; you probably only go because you feel guilty or obligated. Instead, spend more time with your family and friends—or volunteer. There are better uses of your time and money.”

“Most people don’t care about any religious ties to the season because church and religion are not what Americans care about during this time of year—they care about family and friends and giving presents and food and having fun,” said Public Relations Director Dave Muscato. “Many so-called ‘Christmas’ traditions celebrated by Americans have nothing to do with Christianity. For example, the North Pole and Santa traditions come from Nordic and Germanic pagan traditions, and caroling, yule logs, mistletoe, holly wreaths all pre-date Christianity,”

“We all love this time of year,” Silverman added. “Christianity has been trying to claim ownership of the season for hundreds of years. But the winter solstice came first and so did its traditions. The season belongs to everybody.”

The billboard sequence runs for fifteen seconds three times each hour. The campaign moves to a dramatic 3-board display at Penn Station next week, and continues through New Year’s Day, only a few months ahead of American Atheists’ 40th National Convention in Salt Lake City over Easter weekend in April.

The 2014 National Convention will feature such speakers such as NFL star Chris Kluwe, Survivor®: Philippines grand prizewinner Denise Stapley, Grammy-winning Spin Doctors bass player Mark White, Reverend Barry Lynn of Americans United for the Separation of Church and State, Maryam Namazie of the Council of Ex-Muslims, popular bloggers PZ Myers and Greta Christina, and American Atheists President David Silverman. The convention will also feature a costume party, live music, stand-up comedy, an art show and silent auction, national and local exhibitors, and childcare options for attending families. The convention takes place the weekend of April 17-20, 2014.

AMERICAN ATHEISTS is a national 501(c)(3) organization that defends civil rights for atheists, freethinkers, and other nonbelievers; works for the total separation of religion and government; and addresses issues of First Amendment public policy. American Atheists celebrates its 50th anniversary this year.

Still images from the animation:

Video of the animation is available on YouTube here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBjHWij5HWY

Shortlink: http://tinyurl.com/atheistxmas-13

and may be reproduced and redistributed by the press under the conditions that no cropping or editing is performed and no overlays cover any part of the video (including the website at the bottom), and that American Atheists is credited for providing it.

Video of the actual board as displayed in Times Square is available on YouTube here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsW7wctb4PE

and may be reproduced and redistributed by the press under the conditions that no cropping or editing is performed and no overlays cover any part of the video (including the website at the bottom), and that American Atheists is credited for providing it.This animation was produced by Seth Andrews, author of Deconverted and founder of TheThinkingAtheist.com.

Footage of the display by Michael Dorian, New York State Director, American Atheists

The entire list of themes celebrated on the billboard reads: family, friends, charity, food, music, gifts, snow, lights, decorations, stockings, fun, ice skating, Rockettes®, parties, movies, Chinese food, human life, hot chocolate.

American Atheists, Inc.
P.O. Box 158
Cranford, NJ 07016
Tel: (908) 276-7300
Fax: (908) 276-7402

For More Information Contact:
Dave Muscato, Public Relations Director 908-276-7300 x7, [email protected]

Keywords: American Atheists, War on Christmas, billboard, Times Square, New York, New York City, Manhattan, Midtown, Christmas, Holidays, Happy Holidays, Xmas, December, atheism, humanism, freethought

 

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  • Sean Hurt

    I like this one a lot. Some of the billboards AA comes out with tend to be geared more towards trolling religious people rather than promoting a message of our own.

  • Pingback: American Atheists taking the Christ out of Xmas in Times Square!

  • Seh Cheng Liang

    Charity related to money seems unhealthy as external blood might be contaminated. Volunteering is the correct word.

  • Derek

    Why the need to smash other peoples beliefs? Technically Christmas IS a religious holiday. Again a Liberal group trying to tell people what is best to do with their time, MONEY and their lives. Just a reminder I am not a religious person myself, before you start the left wing tactics of name calling.

    • Matthew

      A religious holiday yes, but not a christian one.
      And stop whining with the whole “urr durrp liberuls huuuh evil basterds left wingists”, you just sound like a stupid idiot who doesn’t know how to make a good argument and prefer putting the blame on somebody else.

      • Gravel

        Lol, you just proved his point with the name calling and adding insults he didn’t say!!! Thank you.

        • Robert Jory

          To be honest Derek was asking for it. He says don’t voice your opinion on others beliefs and then says don’t voice an opinion on my beliefs or you’re one of these labels that I consider beneath me. Everyone can say what they think and his prediction of being ridiculed doesn’t prove any point other than opinions are open to criticism no matter what you wish for.

  • Jon Bianchy

    I can have Christ and still do all the other things that this Billboard states! No matter how much you fight you will never win. Use these funds to help people who can’t celebrate Christmas and to help those in need that you say don’t need “prayer but help”. Well use the money invested in these Billboards to help those people. Remember something, the is a Beacon, there is Remnant of people that will never give up Chist! Yes it is called CHRISTmas!!

    • Robert Jory

      It’s one billboard. How about all the millionaire religious leaders use their money to help the needy instead of buying themselves fancy things or fiddling with children’s private bits. All the traditions of your “christ’mas are all from pagan beliefs long ago. If Jesus was even real he wasn’t born anytime near the winter solstice.

      • marahnatha

        Well, there’s one thing we agree on. God blesses us so we can bless others, not so we can have the biggest bank account when Jesus comes back. Anybody can say they believe in God, but where they spend their money is pretty telling. As for Christmas being “pagan,” it isn’t, & we know it isn’t literally his Birthday, just as Passover isn’t literally the day Moses crossed the Red Sea, but we acknowledge the events anyway as a remembrance. Child molesters should be put in prison for life ESPECIALLY if they are members of the clergy, school teachersor other positions of authority.

  • Jon Bianchy

    Fighting so much and using funds to tell people what to do with their lives. Such hipocrites, always saying that Christian want to tell people in whom to belief or what to do but your organization is trying to do the same. What people don’t see is that you are not traying to fight for their rights, but atheists have an agenda against God to simply destroy anything that has God in it. I belief in God and I will never shove in peoples throat to belief in God, it is not an obligation, you have the freedom to choose.

    • Robert Jory

      Atheists just want people to know there is another option and to enjoy life for what it is without the fear of eternal punishment by an imaginary eavesdropper in the sky. An anti-theist is someone who wants religion destroyed because it is a disgusting cult. I am the latter.

      • UPDATED

        Ok Robert, Put up a big board saying that about Islam! You wont! Because you are a coward, Its easy to be a bully to a religion that wont fight back, So be a big man and do it to Islam

        • Robert Jory

          If I had the money I’d do it myself. I’m not afraid of Islam. Muslims throw acid on their women’s faces or killing them for speaking out because they are the cowards, not because they are brave. I do not fear cowards.

  • Imogen Ation

    You cant argue with a Christian. They will make up a nonsensical argument like “unicorns fart glitter” and then call you the devil. They lack the ability for rationalthought or discussion. Ignorance is bliss I suppose.

    • George

      Or you can say the same about a group that believes that we all came from nothing, and loudly proclaims it from a Times Square giant electronic billboard. Why not change the billboard to just skip to stupid?

      • Robert Jory

        Not all atheists believe we came from nothing. That’s the thing about science, you can try different ideas until you find what is true. Physicists that spend their life in that field know a lot more about physics than you or I. They believe something can come from nothing. When you have a master’s in physics then I’ll listen to your opinion on whether it’s possible.

        • George

          Bwahahaha. Anything to try to avoid the obvious. That’s why no one will have an excuse at the end of their lives. God has made it certain that we can’t escape the thoughts of our time and his eternity.

          Physicists will continue to dig with the flawed scientific methodology that necessarily excludes an all powerful God that is greater than His creation and can transcend physics. So their findings will always be limited by their method of determination. God made it so, to show them their foolishness.

          “They believe that something can come from nothing.” Ha ha… like the emperor’s new clothes. LOL …and “smart” people actually buy into it.

          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X_YHbda_J4Y

          • Robert Jory

            You show a video of a biologist talking about physics. Of course he isn’t going to come off as an expert, he’s not. Lawrence Krauss is though. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JIDmzLfk0K0

          • George

            Krauss redefines what is meant by “nothing” to give credence to his belief. You should take a gander at the NYT review of his book. They call him out on it.

            “He complains that “some philosophers and many theologians define and redefine ‘nothing’ as not being any of the versions of nothing that scientists currently describe,” and that “now, I am told by religious critics that I cannot refer to empty space as ‘nothing,’ but rather as a ‘quantum vacuum,’ to distinguish it from the philosopher’s or theologian’s idealized ‘nothing,’ ” and he does a good deal of railing about “the intellectual bankruptcy of much of theology and some of modern philosophy.” But all there is to say about this, as far as I can see, is that Krauss is dead wrong and his religious and philosophical critics are absolutely right. Who cares what we would or would not have made a peep about a hundred years ago? We were wrong a hundred years ago. We know more now. And if what we formerly took for nothing turns out, on closer examination, to have the makings of protons and neutrons and tables and chairs and planets and solar systems and galaxies and universes in it, then it wasn’t nothing, and it couldn’t have been nothing, in the first place. And the history of science — if we understand it correctly — gives us no hint of how it might be possible to imagine otherwise.”

            http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/25/books/review/a-universe-from-nothing-by-lawrence-m-krauss.html?_r=0

          • Robert Jory

            Words can mean different things in layman’s terms or scientific terms. Just look at the word “theory”. In layman’s terms it means a guess or a hunch. In science it can mean anything from a new hypothesis to a well established fact. Just because a newspaper says he’s wrong doesn’t make it true. We have experts in certain fields for a reason. Who is the NYT’s physics expert?

          • George

            You don’t need to be an expert to call somebody out for passing off “something” as “nothing” and then selling the premise that everything could have come from this “nothing” so we don’t need a Creator God as an explanation. But it’s not like expect these anti-Christian atheist types to portray facts honestly when they have an agenda they’re pushing as Krauss does.

        • Mark

          Why don’t you go live some where else if you don’t like our foundation? We were founded on Christianity and that’s how it is. You won’t change the minds of Gods servants!

          • Mark

            I think not!

          • Robert Jory

            You’re such an angry person Mark. Must be a Christian. Let’s look at the facts about the founding fathers. http://www.adherents.com/gov/Founding_Fathers_Religion.html

          • Mark

            I’m not angry! I have peace in my heart. You on the other hand have contempt. You refuse to leave Christians alone because they don’t accept you. You cannot force someone to accept your foolish ways!

          • Robert Jory

            You’re right. You can not force someone to see the truth. They must shed their chains of religion on their own. You can, however, force someone to follow a cult. Children are indoctrinated into the cult of human sacrifice known as Christianity everyday and it makes me want to fight the evils of religion all the more fervently. But yea, keep insulting me and think yourself not angry. You could do so much more good for the world. Awaiting your next strident comment.

          • Mark

            I said you cannot force someone to accept your foolish ways! Don’t try and twist my words around you little clown. God is the creator, and he created clowns like you for our entertainment.

          • Robert Jory

            If I was a clown I think you’d be a little more happy than you appear to be. From the things you type I’d assume you’re quite angry. You keep saying you’re not yet you keep calling me names and sounding even more enraged. Thought Christians are told to turn the other cheek and treat others as they wish to be treated. Guess not.

          • Mark

            I don’t turn the other cheek when satin tries to attack the father. And calling you a clown is a nice way to cope with your stupidity.

          • Robert Jory

            You call me the clown but it’s you who is rather funny. By the way satin is a fabric, Satan is your imaginary nemesis. Which makes it even funnier that you call me stupid. Oh the irony.

          • Mark

            I am not passive like you clowns think we should be. I will not roll over for your sake. You are an attention seeker. There is no depth satin would stoop to spread his lies.

          • Robert Jory

            So much for the peace loving Jesus follower. You’re more like the Islamic suicide bomber type but for Christianity. Balls deep in fanatic fervor. Don’t spread too much hate, your Jesus might not let you into your imaginary heaven.

          • Mark

            You can try and charge me with what ever means at your disposal. But it doesn’t change the fact that if you don’t repent you will end up in the lake of fire!!

          • Robert Jory

            For that to be a fact, as you call it, you’d have to be able to prove it. There is no proof that there is conscientiousness after death or that we go to a magical place of happiness or torture. Have fun living a life of fear of punishment by a psychotic, cruel, jealous, misogynist in the sky.

          • Mark

            I would much rather have faith in the Lord my God than to die without anything to look forward to than the lake of fire!

          • Robert Jory

            Well there is no lake of fire unless you’re talking about a volcano. Why not just enjoy life for what it is: a brief experience on one planet out of an uncountable number of planets that you just happened to be born on. Why add magic when nature and science are already awe inspiring as it is?

          • Mark

            Satin cannot defeat God! He lies and tries to deceive the flesh, but Gods powers are far greater than the wicked ones.

          • Robert Jory

            Satin is a fabric but I get what you’re saying. But can superman beat batman? Who knows, neither are real.

          • Mark

            You have no facts that stand up. You like to make it up as you go. Get a grip clown! You can’t force your way on us. You keep trying but you will always lose!

          • Mark

            Sufficient Grace

            2
            Corinthians 12:7-10

            I thought the Christian life was going to be
            easier than this. Have these words ever entered your mind? Sometimes we
            come into the family of God thinking that our heavenly Father will fix all our
            problems and devote Himself to our happiness and comfort. However, that is not
            the reality portrayed in Scripture. Paul was a man whom the Lord used greatly,
            and yet his life was anything but easy.

            In fact, at one point, the apostle thought
            his pain was too much to bear, and he begged God to remove it. There’s nothing
            wrong with asking the Lord to relieve our suffering, but what should our
            response be if He doesn’t? Paul probably had no idea that His experience would
            find its way into the Bible, to comfort and guide believers throughout the ages.
            The promise God gave him applies to us as well: “My grace is sufficient for you”
            (v. 9).

            God’s grace could be defined as His
            provision for us at the point of our need. The problem is that sometimes it
            doesn’t seem as if the Lord truly is meeting our need. But He frequently sees
            deficiencies, outcomes, and complications that we don’t. His goals for us
            involve spiritual growth, the development of Christlike character, and strong
            faith. And trials play a vital role in achieving these.

            The important issue is how we respond. If
            all you want is relief, you could descend into anger and doubt. But if your
            desire is to become the person God wants you to be, you’ll see each trial as an
            opportunity for Christ to display His character and strength in you

        • Rob_Drury

          “When you have a master’s in physics then I’ll listen to your opinion on whether it’s possible.”

          I have a master’s in aeronautical science, which includes a lot of physics. I have yet to see any scientific evidence that refutes God’s existence. Combine that with the fact that I have first-hand contact with the creator of the universe rather than multiple conflicting scientific theories, none of which appear to be plausible, and your physicist doesn’t have much to offer.

          • Robert Jory

            “I have first-hand contact with the creator of the universe” Ok just based on that statement I can say you are insane. If the voices tell you to kill anyone, don’t listen!

          • Rob_Drury

            No; based on that statement you can say that you believe me to be insane. In reality, the best you can claim about the existence of God is that you simply don’t know. Christians have the advantage of first-hand experience with the truth.

          • Robert Jory

            I don’t know if unicorns or fairies exist either but I’m about as sure they aren’t real as I am about god. Can I prove they are made up? No. But common sense says they most likely are. Actually thinking that a supernatural being that hides his existence from everyone speaks to you makes you either delusional or insane. You tell me which one you are.

          • Rob_Drury

            Nothing special about me. He speaks to everyone who knows Him. That’s an enormous group.

      • Imogen Ation

        Way to proclaim your ignorance George. Slow Clap. Now, troll on!

    • marahnatha

      You can’t argue with an atheist because they say stupid stuff like the unicorn thing. What kind of of debating skill is that? The devil is a fallen angel & humans are not angels. I guess you’d know about ignorance because from what you’ve posted, I don’t see where you’ve ever even known a Christian.

  • Beverly Vokoun

    On the question of who needs Christ in Christmas….I would say evidently Christians do. Why is it so necessary to make all Christians into Atheists? Or at least put them down all the time. That’s what they believe….so what??? I was a Christian for 60 years and have been an Atheist for 13 years. The truth needs to be seen by them…or we are no better than the Christians that try to shove their religion down our throats….it just doesn’t work.

    • Robert Jory

      It’s done to help people. Some have been brainwashed into thinking they can only be good if they follow the church and know of no other way to be. Outspoken atheists show them that there is another option and it’s not forced by fear of an eternal punishment while they are children.A lot of people don’t believe in god but call themselves Christian because of the social stigma to say otherwise.

      • marahnatha

        America is a post-Christian nation, totally in moral decline. There is no “stigma” for not being a Christian. No “stigma” for out of wedlock babies that grow up without a father, no “stigma” for the man that brags he has 8 “baby mommas” with 14 kids, all on welfare, no “stigma” for a law student needing somebody to pay for her birth control because she’s “entitled” to it, no “stigma” for a beach bum who buys lobster with food stamps and has no desire to get a job. This is the America of unbelievers. We’re all just monkeys that came out of a slime pit anyway. And what difference does it make, anyway, at this point?

        • Robert Jory

          There are stigmas for all those things. Majority of parents don’t want their kids to grow up to be on welfare, drugs and have dozens of kids. They don’t want their kids to be homeless or in prison. These are all things people don’t want for the ones they love but they do happen because people make poor choices. It has nothing to do with believing or not. Over half of the US labels themselves as Christian in the census and yet all these things happen that you’ve stated. Those are things being done by believers. How is it an atheist problem?
          As for the monkey part, yes, we are primates that evolved from other primates. We did not however evolve from modern monkeys. We split millions of years ago and evolved on different paths. Coming from slime is a different subject altogether. The beginning of life has nothing to do with the theory of evolution but instead refers to abiogenesis. That’s the idea of life starting from basic elements.

          • George

            Atheists have such faith in their religion of chance. Not a shred of real evidence, but plenty of faith. Gotta love them!

          • Robert Jory

            It’s the lack of evidence in there being a god that makes me an atheist. What chance are you talking about? If you mean evolution then it is not about chance or randomness. The mutations may be random but natural selection is anything but random. I have faith in things that are real, like people who spend their lives researching and testing things that are real. I do not have faith in an old book about mythology.

          • George

            When you make the standard ONLY the observable, testable, etc., and then use the gathered evidence to validate what is NOT observable, testable, etc., then you have crossed the realm into the philosophical.

            Darwinian evolution where one family of animal becomes a different family is not observable, and evidence actually points to the contrary. See the fossil record where NO EVIDENCE exists to suggests that single celled organisms evolved into complex organisms.

            What we see is the sudden appearance of well developed organisms with eyes, lungs, appendages, etc. neatly layered above smaller single celled organisms with no evidence of transition.

            Yet because science will not allow for the supernatural, scientists are stuck. They MUST continue to pursue a dead end and try to tie together whatever ends they can ply their way to conform to their imposed scientific worldview.

            And on top of that, there is no evidence that life could have started accidentally as suggested by those that have no other observable option. And on this stands the whole theory of evolution like a house of cards.

            By the way, did you know that mutations are deadly, right? And did you know that chromosomes that split are rendered cancerous or dead and incapable or reproducing, right? Yet this model is touted as the linchpin of all these progressive changes from single cell to mammal. SMH that we’ve let this lunacy seriously go on this long.

            What the latest theory? I remember when they believed that little ape changed into big ape into caveman into hairy man. Haha. Now we have the bush theory. Soon we’ll have the alien theory. LOL Grasping at straws…

            God laughs at your feeble attempts to find your origin without Him when it is SO obvious. Blind much?

          • Robert Jory

            Your ignorance is astounding. So we can’t test if there is or isn’t an invisible man in the sky so you assume there is. I guess you also believe in the 1000 other gods that humans have made up as well since we can’t technically prove them false.

            Biologists are in a consensus that evolution is fact. Considering they are the experts in their field and you are not I would say they are right. Not a single shred of evidence has been found to prove evolution false. All it would take is one fossil to date in the wrong period and it all falls apart yet none has been recovered.

            The event of life coming from non living elements is not evolution. That is called abiogenesis and has nothing to do with evolution. Evolution is about mutations and natural selection, how different species came from an original species that branched. Scientists have been able to recreate a simulation of the first life beginning. They used what they believe to be the ancient earth environment and the elements present to create RNA, which is like DNA but with a different sugar. DNA has deoxyribose while RNA just has ribose.

            Scientists will not allow the supernatural because most the time it’s wrong. People say they took a picture of a ghost and science proves it not. The awesome thing about science is it’s always trying to find more answers. Then when one is found other scientists can test and debunk or prove it correct. Religion doesn’t do that. It is stuck believing in bronze age superstitions.

            Mutations by definition are not deadly. They are just a change in the genes which can cause something bad or something good. Cat fur color variation is a mutation in their genes but that doesn’t kill them does it? Those mutations are random but depending if they are beneficial or unfavorable determines if the mutation dies with the animal or is passed on because it helps them survive and reproduce. Cancer is a mutation but is usually caused by an external source such as radiation or genetically modified material.

            Theories about our origin will change as we learn more and increase our knowledge. Why do you scoff at the fact science has changed it’s mind about things? That’s the whole point of science. If something is considered fact but later disproved then we know something new.

            The realm of religion is getting smaller and smaller as science advances. One day Christianity will be in the same category as Roman and Greek mythology. The only thing obvious about god is that he’s man made and has been for thousands of years before Christianity.

          • George

            First, God is provable, you just don’t want to do what it takes to realize that truth. Your pride will leave you blind. His offer of proof is to the individual that humbles himself before Him and seeks the truth. Until then, you will continue to make silly arguments that lumps the God Creator of the Bible with all the gods of mythology instead of looking at the validity of the written record.

            What we observe today is what the Bible has carefully and accurately reported from the begining. A sun, a moon, stars, an unseen power holding all together, animals each of their own kind, 2 sexes, etc. No elephant-headed creature with a man’s body, or other like weird creatures like other religions or myths. It also accurately has documented cities that existed long ago and have been found in recent history lending even more to its credence. Yet your strawman argument lumps them all together so you can seemingly tear them all down together.

            Secondly, consensus is not fact. Similarity does not prove relation, yet scientifically it is passed off as such and no other theory is even entertained. Biologist do not have a choice but to ASSUME evolution and they will point out the similarity that is in ALL living things because we are all made up of the same molecules and ingest the same organic matter to survive. How does the simpler carp have 100 pairs of chromosomes while a man has 23?

            Another assumption is that the geologic column was laid down one strata at a time and that therefore it is a indication of time. THAT is a base ASSUMPTION that cannot be observed and which the evidence indicates much to the contrary.

            Watch “Drama in the rocks” documentary and you will see an observable experiment that shows howsediment that appears to be layed down horizontally is actually laid down vertically.

            http://www.creatie.info/videos/vidid/48

            And I know what abiogenesis is, but evolution is built on the assumption that this life creating event happened one time and that living organism reproduced and changed into something more complex. No way to observe it and failure in the lab to reproduce it.

            You may want to know that manipulating chemicals in a controlled environment WITHOUT OXIGEN (which was present at the time scientist suppose life began) did produce a few amino acids, but as soon as oxygen was introduced, it rendered the experiment a complete failure.

            But despite creating a few amino acids in the lab without oxygen, the dirty little secret is that it would take 300 or more such amino acids, all left handed, brought together (by what force?) into a condensed location and encapsulated by a membrane in order to create a cell. Fat chance of that, heh? Oh, and millions of molecules to boot…

            And mutations are 99% deadly. Pigmentation, adapation and speciation is not mutation. The genetic code for those changes already exists in DNA. It is not new, only a variation. It’s not like growing a wing where an arm used to be.

            A fact is something that is true 100% and doesn’t change because of a new discovery. That is called an assumption (whether reasonable or not). Scientific fact (not) is being used to imply that Christianity is false which is ludicrous. That reasoning is fraught with error and that is what you are doing. You cannot disprove the spiritual realm with an exclusively physical methodology that cannot take into account a supernatural event. That’s just silly.

            Come off it Robert, you’re standing on sand and that storm is coming when you’ll have to face the reality of death as we all do. You better consider all these things honestly before it’s too late. God loves you first, but He will execute His perfect judgement completely when the time comes. Of our own free will, you and I both failed to live up to the standard that He set, that is why He made a way for us to be saved.Don’t spit in the face of the one who will judge you later.

          • Robert Jory

            You obviously are too scared to see reality so I’ll just let you be delusional. Arguing with a Christian is a waste of time if you’re that indoctrinated. BTW science doesn’t try to disprove god, common sense does that. You really think all the thousands of other religions are wrong but your cult of human sacrifice is right. Arrogant and stupid.

            http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/05/ribonucleotides/

            http://www.wimp.com/eyeevolution/

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mhX2Kas558

            Enjoy

          • George

            I’m arrogant and stupid? LOL You’re the one that believes in nothing because it created everything we see today and you KNOW that God is a myth. Haha. Sad…

          • Robert Jory

            I never said I believe everything came from nothing. Some scientists do, that doesn’t mean all atheists do. See how arrogant you are? Unlike religious nut jobs atheists don’t have one belief they all MUST share. We can each think what we want about the unknown. I don’t know god 100% doesn’t exist but from what I’ve seen in life it’s very very unlikely. There’s no reason to believe in him or any of the thousands of other gods. Good day.

          • George

            Thanks for the entertaining videos/article. Atheists are so amusing at times. It just shows the gullibility of those who have decided to abandon the search for the truth and settle for the vain imaginations of men.

            This video is from a Nobel prize winning Molecular Biologist Elizabeth Blackburn

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=5PU_jZwt8KY#t=444s

            Since your scientist guy in the video makes it seem so simple to have a little light sensing spot on a simple organisms, let’s just level set a bit. From a favorite author…

            “The human eye is an amazing interrelated system of about forty individual subsystems, including the retina, pupil, iris, cornea, lens, and optic nerve. It has more to it than just the 137 million light-sensitive special cells that send messages to the unbelievably complex brain. About 130 million of these cells look like tiny rods, and they handle the black and white vision. The other 7 million are cone shaped and allow us to see in color. The retina cells receive light impressions, which are then translated into electric pulses and sent directly to the brain through the optic nerve.

            A special section of the brain called the visual cortex interprets the pulses as color, contrast, depth, etc., which then allows us to see “pictures” of our world. Incredibly, the eye, optic nerve, and visual cortex are totally separate and distinct subsystems. Yet together they capture, deliver, and interpret up to 1.5 million pulse messages per millisecond! Think about that for a moment. It would take dozens of computers programmed perfectly and operating together flawlessly to even get close to performing this task.

            The eye is an example of what is referred to as “irreducible complexity.” It would be statistically impossible for random processes, operating through gradual mechanisms of genetic mutations and natural selection, to be able to create forty separate subsystems when they provide no advantage to the whole until the very last state of development. Ask yourself how the lens, the retina, the optic nerve, and all the other parts in vertebrates that play a role in seeing not only appeared from nothing, but evolved into interrelated and working parts. To say that the eye happened without a Designer is ridiculous”

            And if you want some more, chew on this dinosaur leg. 68 million years old? Pfffttt…

            http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/dinosaur.html

          • Robert Jory
          • George

            So let me get this straight… 2 guys heard about Dr. Mary Schweitzer’s soft tissue find and they decided to chop up their own specimens and found what they termed as slime. So they concluded that what she found was probably slime. too. Hahaha.

            You got to be kidding me. Aren’t dinosaur bones supposed to be fossilized at this point in time after the supposed 68 million years? Think about that. LOL I think I’ll go with the stretchy tissue that I see in the pictures. It looks like a nice strip steak to me. Hahaha.

            Ok, so you’re telling me that you don’t believe that something came from nothing, but it didn’t come from a Creator. Hmmm… so what scientifically measurable alternative would that be… because I’m assuming you don’t believe in some scientifically immeasurable origin like the Christian God you mock?

          • Robert Jory

            Well something that is scientifically measurable is that the universe is expanding. So one theory that is possible is that the universe goes through cycles of expanding and then collapsing back on itself and then expanding again. Since we can’t go back in time there is no definite way to know for sure but just because we don’t know doesn’t mean we should use the god of gaps. Common sense just tells me that there is no point to believing one god is real over another and since they all think they are right it’s possible they are all wrong.

            No one now a days dies and comes back to life days later to tell us what happens after you die so no one knows. We have no memory of before we were born and it’s most likely we’ll have no memory after we die. We do know that when part of the brain is damaged that memories or functions can be inhibited. So when you die and lose all brain function do you suddenly have all your memories again when your soul goes to heaven or hell? If it’s not your physical body how do you even feel pain in hell? It is just illogical to believe in this stuff. Nothing more than a cult of human sacrifice.

          • Rob_Drury

            What an intelligent idiot!

          • Robert Jory

            Guess you gave up arguing for your blind faith. At least try to make a point with your attempts to insult me.

          • Rob_Drury

            No; I was insulting Dawkins. Of course, I’m guessing that you’d be incredible proud to be associated among his ranks.

    • Rob_Drury

      There is no such thing as a former Christian.

      • Beverly Vokoun

        WHAT?????? Care to explain that?

        • Rob_Drury

          Christianity is not a religion or a belief system; Christianity is a relationship involving direct mutual involvement and communication between God and man. It’s safe to suggest that most who consider themselves Christians do not have such a relationship. The true Christian doesn’t “believe” in Christ; he KNOWS Christ. How does one simply lose or choose to erase that knowledge? It’s not possible.

          • Cthulhu21

            -_- right then.

  • Imogen Ation

    Use the money you spend on MegaChurches to help people. And the moneg you spend lobbying to shove your religious beliefs into laws…and help people. BE Christian. And we should be FINE w christian billboards
    And people knocking on our door to harass us and threaten us with burning for all eternity…but its not OK for us to post a single billboard advocating family and food over your made up diety on a holiday that was never yours to begin with. Makes PERFECT sense. If you are Christian I mean.

    • JQuincy

      You have the right to ignore.

      • Imogen Ation

        So do you. At least the billboard doesn come knocjing on your door just as you get your baby down for a nap. Or tell your kids they will burn in hell for eternity.

        • marahnatha

          Christians don’t tell children they will burn in hell for eternity. Children don’t have any concept of “next month,” much less eternity. We do teach that Jesus loves the little children. Red & yellow, black & white, we are precious in His sight. Real offensive stuff like that.

    • marahnatha

      Most of the people on these forums are not “mega-church people. They are out making money because “God wants them rich.” Since PTL & Jimmy Swaggart, apart rom shut-ins, I don’t know anybody that even watches Christian TV programs. Jehovah’s Witnesses are the ones who knock on your door & they don’t even believe in hell. Nobody cares about your billboards. Just let ours alone & respect our right as well.

  • Gravel

    Your argument seems very intelligent. I can’t understand why a Christian wouldn’t want to debate you.

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  • Concerned Citizen

    A few things to note:
    1. “You should spend your money on charity not billboards” is an unreasonable critique because that charge could leveled against everyone who’s paid for a billboard that isn’t strictly to do with charity and also charity is subjective, to the purchaser of the billboard helping someone free themselves from a church is a charitable act.
    2. “Atheist just want to destroy everything with God in it” maybe some atheist do, maybe some atheist want a ham sandwich, maybe some atheist want a new hat but we can’t say’ Atheist want (insert statement)’ because like everyone else Atheist are individuals, this is just one atheist organization who has their own way of expressing their ideology (it’s not like the have a codified book or anything …)
    3. Christmas (or Christ’s Mass) is the name for an amalgamation of traditions that have be coopted into praising the birth of the Jesus figure in Christianity. As we’ve become a more secular society we can mold it as we see fit because if it were strictly a religious holiday we shouldn’t allow any special provisions to it, that’d inherently be unfair unless we gave Hannukah and Ramadan the same weight, it’s a secular holiday. So if some want to keep the Christian aspect they’re welcome to if some want it to be about trees, turkey and Santa it’s their choice too.

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  • Matt

    I am atheist and I don’t like this billboard’s message. It is disrespectful and myopic. If we are to engage with people of every belief and have real meaningful conversation we need to avoid this kind of intentionally provocative and offensive message that American Atheists have put up in Times Square. What’s that saying?…not in my name? As an atheist I do not wish to be associated with this kind of message.

    • Robert Jory

      If they truly believe what they say then this should roll off them like rain on a duck. They only get angry and offended because part of them knows it’s all fake. But to admit they’ve lived a lie their whole life is difficult. No one likes to admit they were wrong and would rather become aggressive. This billboard is telling people who are on the edge that there is another option and that you can enjoy the same traditions without the superstitions. Atheist is not a group with an agenda. Atheists are just anyone who doesn’t believe in a god. There are no rules to follow or membership to join. If this offends you then you are no better than the raging religious fools.

      • Matt

        It’s not acceptable to insult someone’s beliefs and then say, “Oh it should just roll off those raging religious fools’ backs.” And to insult me like that in the your last sentence is deplorable. Have some respect for your fellow human beings regardless if they believe in a god or not. It is just plain rude to cross out the name of a deity other people love and then to say that nobody needs him especially during the holiday that celebrates him. I don’t believe in any religion, but I’m not going to go up to my family on Christmas and announce that nobody needs Jesus. Furthermore American Atheists IS a group with an agenda, but even more than that people are going to associate that billboard with atheism itself, not just American Atheists and atheists.org So I do feel it necessary to identify myself as an atheist who disagrees with this message. Heck, if need be I’ll join American Atheists just to officially announce that I disagree with this billboard’s message.

        • NorwegianThunder

          People deserve dignity. Ideas don’t have dignity.

          A criticism of a process or a criticism of a cultural practice or a criticism of a religious text is not the same as the criticism of a person.

          • Matt

            This billboard is talking to people. And it insults some of those people.

          • Robert Jory

            The bible teaches them to turn the other cheek and to forgive their aggressors. If they can’t handle one billboard maybe they aren’t as Christian as they thought they were. Or maybe part of them understands it’s all made up and don’t want to face to truth that they were wrong this whole time.

          • Matt

            That’s no excuse to insult people’s beliefs. Sure they may believe in something we recognize as disgusting, but they probably don’t see it that way and this billboard is definitely not going to make them see it that way. The benefit of doubt should be that they are good-hearted people who intend no harm. Again I agree with you that religion should be a thing of the past, but we aren’t going to change minds by being rude and publicly trashing millions of people’s beliefs. This billboard could use a re-write with more tact and consideration to get the intended message across with a better attitude. That’s all I’m saying.

          • George

            You know what I find disgusting? Sin. Sin of every kind, but especially sin in me. Thank God He made a way for me to be free of it.

            You may want to start there. Your atheistic view does not account for how you fail to live up to even your own low standard. Yet your conscience tells you that God’s commandments are the perfect standard, which all fail to keep.

            Imagine when an imperfect man stands before a perfect God who will execute perfect justice completely. Imagine then not having taken Him up on His free offer of reconciliation by the sacrifice of Jesus, his atoning lamb.

            Do you think you will find Christian beliefs disgusting then? No, the truth of your rebellion will come up on you in a flash and you will bow before a righteous God who did everything possible to save you from your perverse choice.

            I will pray for you, Matt. You seem like a decent person, but you are blind to reality just as this former atheist once was. You need to stand back and take an honest look inside. You know the truth because God gave you a soul and a conscience. There will be no excuse for those who fail to acknowledge the rightful authority in life…

          • Cameron Durham

            Wow…Don’t force your crap on other people. If Matt doesn’t want you to pray for him, treat him like the decent human being you say he is and honour his request. I don’t see how you could possibly be a former atheist. I know they exist, I just don’t see how.

          • George

            Cameron, I don’t mince words. There is only one truth and atheist find themselves on the untenable position of believing that everything came from nothing. It only takes a person one a minute to consider that and start on the road of searching for the truth.

            As a former atheist, that is my story. I went from believing that when I die I cease to exist and no worries… to there is more to it than that because we can’t just have happened from nothing.

            Once you start searching, you need to look at the evidence fairly, else you do yourself a injustice. If you seek fairly and diligently, and ask God humbly, He will open the door and you will know Him.

            Simple as that…

          • Cameron Durham

            I cannot believe that you just said, “everything came from nothing.” In no way does anyone actually believe that. Do a little bit of research on what we believe before you accuse it of being ridiculous, because I completely agree that something from nothing is impossible.

          • mary

            There’s only one atheist commentor on this site. He just keeps changing his name. Read the posts. The grotesque, dripping hatred is obviously from the same voice in each comment.

          • johnjohnson

            Sounds like you are as bitter as him

          • Cameron Durham

            There is no hatred. I do not hate you, or George, or anyone else I respond to unless, of course, they call me out and personally insult me, or if they are just plain stupid. I do not believe any of you are stupid, and none of you have insulted me.

          • Tonya

            Yet it is okay for you to insult everyone as long as they dont insult you, who is the arrogant one?

          • mary

            You are filled with hatred. When man has a void within himself, it will be filled with hatred when it refuses love.
            If you don’t believe in God, why do you spend all your time fighting what you believe is imaginary? You’re driven by hatred, not by love.

          • diogeneskarma

            Wrong again mary, there are at least two and neither of us is dripping with hate. We are simply bemused by the ignorance of religiosity. There are many people who think that religiosity is a mental illness. I truly believe that in the future it will be curable. People who believe an invisible deity talks to them in their head daily? Delusional. The reality is that your god is no more valid than any other and yet you insist that he is the only one. Who is arrogant now?

          • Tess Dommer

            IF God doesn’t exist than why do you atheists spend so much time and energy trying to convince the majority and yourself for that matter that HE is a myth? The fact is GOD is real. Look around you. HIS fingerprints are everywhere. And the fact that you’re so bitter is because you have nothing to believe in. Your life is meaningless. If you don’t believe fine but you don’t have the right to attack people and claim that they(WE) (I) are mentally ill. You will call on GOD someday. Trust me. On that note:
            IN GOD WE STILL TRUST IN AMERICA and MERRY CHIRSTmas. GOD BLESS.

          • Now that is just stupid

            Fingerprints? Where? You are mentally ill. You talk to imaginary people.

          • mary

            Do you not get figures of speech?

          • Robert Jory

            Atheists fight against religion for the same reason people fought against slavery, against the suppression of women, against bible thumpers denying homosexuals their right to marriage and live in peace. Your faith causes harm and we are here to prevent that from spreading.

          • Reason

            A curable mental illness? Isn’t that the same argument some Christians make about homosexuals? Have your bigoted opinions, but just know they aren’t welcome in modern society.

          • mary

            C’mon. Let’s not be ridiculous. “Modern Society?” You think society dictates to intelligent people? It always dictates to fools. Read your history.

          • mary

            Dripping with hatred. You remind me of someone I try to avoid like the plague.
            No, there is only one atheist poster on this site with many different names and they are all you.

          • Robert Jory

            The illness is ignorance and it is cured with facts. They just aren’t at the stage to wrap their head around the facts yet.

          • johnjohnson

            You are stubborn and single minded with a hardened heart…however, that can change

          • Cameron Durham

            How am I close-minded? I attempt to live my life as openly and unbiased as possible. I AM stubborn, however, but that is not a bad thing unless you never listen, which is not the case with me.

          • Rob_Drury

            Sorry, Cameron, you can’t get away with that one. You clearly are not viewing these issues “as openly and unbiased as possible.” You boldly deny the existence of God while simultaneously proclaiming that there is no way of knowing. You are incorrect on both counts.

          • Cameron Durham

            I don’t think there is no way of knowing. You cannot directly prove/disprove God, but you can directly prove/disprove everything that goes along with Him, therefore proving/disproving His existence.

          • Rob_Drury

            Thanks for proving my point. You’ve been repeatedly told the reality that God has proven His existence to every true Christian on the planet through direct daily contact. You’re so open-minded that you don’t even consider it a possibility.

          • Tess Dommer

            Isn’t that what you atheists do? You go around being mean spirited, demanding that the 10 Commandments be taken out of our courts and in other public places. Ban the Holy Bible in our Schools, want IN GOD WE TRUST off our currency, Demand that Christmas Songs that mention CHRIST be banned, Deny that we are ONE NATION UNDER GOD etc. You may want to LEARN about the HISTORY of our NATION and about what our FOUNDERS believed. They were NOT atheists but men of FAITH and who embraced GOD. Perhaps you should learn what the first amendment says. And no where in our Constitution are the words SEPARATION of CHURCH and STATE. No one is forcing you or anyone else to believe in GOD and for your 411? GOD is not a RELGION nor is CHRISTIANITY. CHRISTIANITY IS a PHILOSOPHY. And if you cannot understand that simple concept that I nor can anyone else help you. OH and you also don’t get to DECIDE who PRAYS for WHOM. Who DIED and made you GOD? Wise Up.

          • Cameron Durham

            1. Christianity is not a religion? That is undeniably false.

            2. The founding fathers were religious, but there are plenty of quotes in which they specifically said that our nation is in no way a Christian nation, nor one born under any other faith.

            3. We DO demand the 10 Commandments be taken out of our courts, and ban the Holy Bible from our schools, want “In God We Trust” off currency, etc. We demand these because they are unfair. And not just to us, but anyone of any other faith. Do Muslims believe in the Christian god? No. Are they complaining? No, but that doesn’t mean it isn’t unfair to them. And it is not unfair to you to remove religion from the public because you may do what you wish with your beliefs. By not enforcing anything, we are allowing everyone to be comfortable and accounted for.

            Don’t be naive.

          • Tess Dommer

            You’re ignorant. Christianity is in fact a philosophy. Our founders were religious men and said that ALL have FREEDOM of RELIGION to worship as we please without being persecuted. And why should mentions of GOD be removed from our documents and public places just because you demand that they be. You say its unfair yet you the one being unfair. This nation was founded on Judiac Christian principles that is a fact you need to accept. And NO ONE is forcing you to believe in GOD or PRAY or SING CHRISTMAS SONGS or CELEBRATE CHRISTMAS or EASTER or any other HOLIDAY ~ HOLY DAY. Sorry but you and your ILK don’t get to make decisions for the rest of us. IN GOD WE STILL TRUST IN AMERICA. Your free to ignore that and I will support that but you don’t get to DENY the 98% of us who embrace GOD. On that note Merry Christmas and Wise Up.

          • rabbers

            Wow – lots of capitals. I guess you must be right..

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            What is this ‘god’ thing you talk about?
            Is it anything like the Loch Ness monster?
            Or is it more along the lines of the Tooth Fairy?
            Inquiring minds need to know. ASAP.

          • johnjohnson

            Never seen Loch Ness monster, tooth fairy lol
            Look around you at the universe, ocean, animals, insects,DNA, fingerprints, blood components, plants…then just wonder…then ask yourself? Does God exist?

          • TheThinker

            Hmm…..well…..Yes.

          • mary

            You mean God? Did you just crawl out from under a rock? Read the Bible. The stories are great. Finish the book and then talk. No one can argue with people who are completely ignorant in the particular subject being discussed.

          • karmadiogenes

            mary, it is you who are ignorant. If you had read the bible, you would see that the inconsistencies and bigotry in that book are a sad thing to live by. Most Atheists have read the bible, including myself. You, on the other hand should read the studies that link religiosity with a lack of intelligence and then insult a movement that is one of the most educated in the world.

          • Tonya

            You cannot read the Holy Bible with understanding if you dont believe…thats why it did not make sense to you or your atheists friends! Ignorance is not knowing or understanding right. Who is ignorant?

          • Shelly Deitz Popp

            Must you be insulting to attempt to prove your point????

          • A Theist Smarter Than You

            You know what I find disgusting? YOU.

            I, the smarter individual between the 2 of us, refuses to accept that my highly intelligent, rational God will send 5 billion people to eternal torment for something that He did not tell them. If you continue this bigotry, it is you who will receive eternal punishment, for such demonic attitudes cannot enter the unprejudiced realm of Heaven

          • mary

            God sends no one to Hell. People willingly choose the path to Hell.

          • No God Cowboy

            Sin, sin, sin; a simple word, a stupid concept, an idiotic idea and a word invented to force compliance with some idiotic, holy enterprise that ensures a living for certain members of society who think/claim they’ve discovered the keys to eternal life and thereby are owed 10% of society’s wealth for doing very little work.

          • mary

            Sin. A simple concept. There’s no force for compliance against sin. One realizes its detrimental effects on the mind, spirit and body tangibly. It’s a basic law of nature, just like gravity. Everyone knows the effect of sin. Everyone knows what sins are. Everyone makes choices. Descending to one’s baser nature is a choice. The more one sins and justifies, the easier it gets to sin and lie about how happy it makes one feel. Everyone knows how terrible it felt to first sin. Many turned away because of the feelings of cringiness and recoiled from doing what one knew was a violation of truth. Some cannot and will not admit any wrongdoing and lash out to blame others. That’s when you know.

          • Robert Jory

            Sin is not a basic law of nature. Nature kills everyday to survive. It’s what it’s meant to do. They don’t receive punishment for killing their prey. For humans there are consequences for our actions but not for this sin the bible tells us about. If I say “holy fucking jesus christ” that is a sin to you but to me that’s just me releasing some tension during a stressful moment and I am healthier for it. So the things that are sinful to you can actually be good for us. People idolize and worship celebrities. That’s good for business, at least the business of the person being idolized. To you that’s a sin. Some children get abused by terrible parents and the kids fight back against them to break free from a broken home. To you that’s not honoring your parents. Sin.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            As a matter of fact, it is the best excuse to insult people’s beliefs.
            The billboard isn’t for the bible humpers. The billboard is for the fence-sitters and those who don’t realize they are surrounded by silent non-believers who also cherish reality.

          • mary

            Reality. You have no clue what constitutes reality.

          • yosemitedave

            See all the religious cases you attracted to attack atheists? Fence sitters don’t need to be told that they don’t need to believe. If they don’t believe, they don’t believe, no matter what you say.

          • Trina Macko

            I think the fence sitters will decide on their own, and the nasty and illogical quality of that sign will not convince them that God does not exist, just convince them that some are nasty enough to want to Grinch someone else’s holiday.

          • marahnatha

            We aren’t opposed to your billboards at all. Just leave ours alone along with our manger scenes, Ten Commandments, Menorahs, etc. It just exposes you & you don’t even care if it hurts your fellow atheists as long as you can vent your contempt for the God to whom you know you will have to give account.

          • ECD 614

            No Atheist ever challenged the right to display religious bric-a-brac on private property. We object when you trample the Bill of Rights and create a First Amendment violation by using the apparatus of the State.

          • mary

            Everyone has the right to display religious articles on public property. We all pay taxes. The constitution states that the government has no right to impose religion on the people. You misunderstand the law’s purpose.

          • Mark

            Then why are you allowing satin to be an aggressor? Why don’t you just shut up since you don’t believe in anything? It is not for you to judge a believer! If you don’t agree, walk away. Christians don’t welcome your aggression towards them!

          • Robert Jory

            As a non believer it IS up to me to be the judge of what I think is true or not. It’s your god that tells you not to judge yet here you are judging me. If there is a lake of fire I’ll see you in it, buddy.

          • Mark

            No one appointed you judge and jury. Just mind your business since you don’t believe. Don’t try and push your nonsense on people that don’t want it!

          • Robert Jory

            That’s funny coming from a Christian. They have been pushing their beliefs on others from the start of your cult. The Inquisition or Crusades sound familiar? Your Christian ancestors killed those who didn’t believe as they did. Don’t be so butthurt that I question your lunacy. Atheists don’t kill people because they are blind, we try to open their eyes to reality. I am judge and jury of my life, not your imaginary friend.

          • GKC40

            Tell me more about the Inquisition and the Crusades, Robert? And I don’t mean just conjecture about how the Church killed a bunch of people and blah blah blah. I like guys like Matt and Penn Jillette who can actually tolerate those with beliefs different than his own (a very CHRISTIAN principle, mind you). The difference between them and people like you is that they can see merit in our viewpoint in addition to his own, where your only defense is a vitriolic and propagandized renouncement of something you couldn’t begin to understand. You don’t find Christianity compelling because you believe what others in your atheist circles tell you. If you don’t go out and read the documents OBJECTIVELY for yourself, you’ll always have a subjective and skewed view, and by extension you’ll never be able to engage in a true argument between atheism and Christianity.

          • Robert Jory

            Christian tolerance lol. Your Christian god isn’t even tolerant with how many millions he sent his followers to murder in his name and then all the killing he does himself. Those first born must have been pretty evil little babies, huh. If religion was a person believing in something and keeping it to themselves I would have no problem tolerating it. But they have forced it on others since their beginning.
            I grew up in a Christian home. My dad is actually the leader of a Church of Christ. I tried really hard to believe it and be a good Christian. In my early 20s I finally gave up on trying to believe something that was so ridiculous. Don’t tell me I haven’t looked at it objectively, I’ve tried looking at it every way I could just so I could fit in with my family but it’s like trying to believe in Santa as an adult. It’s just silly and believing it is beyond reason.
            To be honest I’m not even here to argue my side. Most religious people are either on the fence and just knowing that not believing is an option is enough for them or the religious fanatics that no matter what you say they will always believe. Like the saying goes arguing with a Christian is like playing chess with a pigeon, no matter how good I am the pigeon knocks all the pieces down, craps on the board and struts around victoriously.

          • GKC40

            Thanks Robert, I appreciate your honesty and for what it’s worth I’m sorry your upbringing in Christianity failed you. I thought a lot of the same things through high school and some of college about whether or not God was real, regardless of whether or not it was reasonable to believe in Him. Sure, I grew up Catholic, but I didn’t know what that meant until I found out for myself. I thought the same as you about the Inquisition until I discovered that not only did the Catholic Church not actually execute prisoners, but criminals *preferred* the Inquisition courts because they were the fairest in all of Europe during that time. I learned that the Bible has a context to it, and that the last thing it should be taken as is an entirely literal document; it’s a collection of books with different genres all serving a singular purpose instead of one single book with one single genre.

            Believing in God is entirely reasonable, and though it may seem similar to believing in Santa, I assure you it’s far from similar. But for me to try and explain it here would be imprudent. Try this link: http://www.magisreasonfaith.org/ask_spitzer.html#ask6

            If you’re interested at all, I’d encourage you to look into specifically Catholic sources for answers to your questions, and the first I would recommend is a radio show on Catholic.com that airs every day. They have a call-in only for Atheists every so often, and they never (I mean never) “crap on the board and strut around victoriously”.

          • robin

            I’m an aggressive atheist, and I’m ashamed of this billboard. This makes atheists look bad and sets us back in the fight for fairness. It’s hypocritical.. it’s one thing to fight to keep jesus out of govt and out of science textbooks, but to blatantly tell christians how to celebrate their holiday in their own privacy is as insulting and offensive as christians telling nonbelievers that they’re going to hell. This makes atheists look no different than proselytizing zealots.

          • mary

            Santa Claus is translated from the Spanish Language as St. Nicholas–a real person on whom our revered holiday gift giver is modeled. You can still believe in him because he did exist. He’s a saint. His feast day is Dec. 5. He is the patron saint of little children. In his life he was an Archbishop of the Catholic Church in Turkey and was kind to the poor.

          • mary

            Thank you for your honesty, Robert. I grew up Catholic. Went to Catholic schools for 12 years and was an atheist when I graduated high school. I thought everyone that believed was a hypocrit. Mass was a joke. The priests were boring. Then I went to a public college and majored in classical English Literature and analysis. We read everything. Greek mythology, symbols, Chaucer, Milton, Shakespeare, Aristotle, Socrates. The Romantics. The seven deadly sins.I learned in college that all of Freud’s theories were based on characters in literature and not on real people–Read Oedipus the King. Freud must have had comprehension issues.
            It was my study of literature and the constant prodding of my Professors to ask questions, go deeper, don’t be afraid to find answers. The answers all exist.
            I’m a Catholic. Very devout. Never stop asking questions and never stop seeking the truth. Before you know it, all the doors will open for you and you’ll see things clearer than you ever thought possible–it’s the light of truth. It’s worth the pursuit. You have to choose to seek. It is not easy. It is long and difficult because you have to think deeper and deeper to make the connections as your knowledge base grows in every discipline.
            Read the Bible first. Laugh. ask questions. Read the associated history of the times depicted. Read and think. You’ll be surprised.

          • Robert Jory

            Reading the bible is probably one of the bigger reasons I’m an atheist. Church likes to only teach the happy bits from the bible and doesn’t like stories like Elisha and the 42 children killed in the name of god.

          • mary

            Your ignorance is on display for every educated person to see.

          • johnjohnson

            Be all the “Judge and Jury” as you wish. I hope your verdict is correct and without error.

          • Robert Jory

            I’m very confident in my verdict of reality. Will be a shame when you die and there’s nothing afterwards for you to look forward to.

          • Trina Macko

            If one is to die, and you say there is nothing, then how could one ‘look forward to’ anything if death is the end? You can’t look forward when there is no more forward motion allowed. And then, what harm does belief do, to believe? If death is just death, as you say, then there will be no frustration or feeling of loss of opportunity, it will just be the end… so there will be no shame or loss of anything… per your definition… So I guess your comment it’s a shame, is rather hollow… the only shame that you state can be felt is now… not later… and none of us knows what comes later, not even you… Wouldn’t it be a shame if there is life after death, and a God, and when you die you go to him and realize you wasted all your life fighting against the idea of him, when you could have been instead learning about him? Seems you have no need or hunger to want to explore… I call that very closed minded.

          • Robert Jory

            There is plenty to look forward to, in life anyway. Why would you want to look forward to death? That’s the kind of thinking that caused 9/11. All in the glorious name of god. The knowledge that there is nothing after death makes us appreciate life all that much more. You have but one life to do everything you’ll ever do, act accordingly. I highly doubt when I die I’ll end up at some pearly gates with some big bearded white man scolding me for not believing in him when he was hiding like a coward. Not happening. The only reason in the world to believe in god is one book written thousands of years ago. Why not believe in the thousand other gods that mankind has made up? Many of them have holy scriptures that tell you what to do or not to do. Do you follow them? No, of course not. Your one religion out of thousands is the correct one because it’s what you were taught by people. Go figure.

            Blind faith does a lot of harm.

            http://drenn1077.com/2012/10/28/what-harm-can-it-be-october-29-2012/

          • Trina Macko

            yup, you are right, blind faith and blind lack of belief can cause a lot of harm.. both can without examination of why the person does and wants to do what they do… I hardly look forward to death… sometimes life gets really burdensome and depression can make life not attractive to some, but I’m not looking to hasten my way there… I’m not afraid of being dead, but do have a lot more I want to do I have not done yet and to accomplish, so I want the time I have left, whatever it is… Other people see God as they see God, and in their teachings… again, I can only share what I know or believe, and I think there is wisdom in every religious code.. most teach people to aspire to be something beyond what they are capable of at a base level, and rise above to nobler instincts than mere existence.. there is wisdom there… I just think, for me, that Jesus makes a lot of sense, it’s what I feel comfortable with, and believe there is a historical accuracy for in terms of the historical events… not accurate to every word, mind you, so don’t nab me on that, but the basic framework of his teachings make sense to me, so I embrace it.. once I rejected it because of bad teaching, hypocrisy I saw in others who preached and I now think were very off base and even crude… heck, who can say that the Catholic Church was right to not condemn and arrest all those priests who molested little kids? Talk about hypocrisy! God does not want that, they are not living as Jesus would want… he said woe to those who would hurt the little ones, they are just men who are making very big mistakes… but God is not wrong, they are. Actually I think those people are totally nuts.. they are NOT Godly.. but I cannot blame God for that.. to say so would be to give those people superiority and say they know better than I, and in this I think they are very wrong, to allow that would be to discredit myself.. I know what is right, and molesting kids is not right… and the people who allow it are not right.. I could never follow after people like that… I think God in his heaven must cry over that to be sure. But puffed out chests and a human need for power or influence affects even those who are in churches, they are human… but are they sincere and really doing as God wants? In this case, I think not.. but I don’t blame GOD for their behavior, just them.

          • Rob_Drury

            Sorry; not possible. The “cult” began long before the first human was even born.

          • Robert Jory

            Which cult? There are ones older than yours.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            “push your nonsense”
            You, sir, owe me a new fuse for my Irony Meter.

          • mary

            American Atheist is a cult. You weren’t aware?

          • Mark

            Ecclesiastes 3:17

            King James Version (KJV)

            I said in mine heart, God shall judge the righteous and the wicked: for there is a
            time there for every purpose and for every work.

          • Robert Jory

            If I quoted a book does that make me more right? No. Your book of lies has no affect on me.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Cripple Fight!
            South Park 5:2

          • BemusedAtheist

            Except you’re just another delusional asshole on the internet who believes his opinion is somehow special. A true atheist is non judgemental and scientific. You are just a judgemental asshole with a low IQ. If this offends you then perhaps you too, should watch your mouth as it works both ways.

          • Robert Jory

            A true atheist. HA. There is no such thing as a true atheist. You are throwing out your opinion about what an atheist should be and expect everyone to follow it. Doesn’t work that way. An atheist by definition is just someone who doesn’t believe in any gods. No where in that definition does it say you must be non judgmental and scientific. I could say I don’t believe in gods because colors smell funny and that would make me an atheist. Your comment doesn’t offend me in the least. In fact it amuses me quite a bit. I’m sorry that you get so upset about my opinion but you have no right to not be offended, that’s just your problem.

          • mary

            The problem is you are not a critical thinker. You are not a humanist. The greatest humanist that ever lived was Christ. You would know that if you were a critical thinker because critical thinkers read and then think about the material they absorb. You are quoting quotes of other people and you have no knowledge on any subject matter to draw from.

            Bemused Atheist is correct. A true Atheist is scientific in his reasoning and does not attack other like an errant with nothing going on in his life.child.

            Why is it Minchin chooses to look like Christ?

            Are all the people you admire just megastars and comedians? Here’s a comedian you might like more:

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SWZ59qIwXGY

          • Robert Jory

            I’m not sure how anyone who does think can believe in a religion. I’ve read plenty of the bible and after thinking about it I see none of it is true. It’s nice for literature but so is Greek mythology. It can be poetic at times but that’s where it’s value ends.

            All an atheist is is someone who doesn’t believe in gods. There are no other requirements to be an atheist. I’m not sure where you guys are getting this “true atheist” definition from.

            Tim Minchin doesn’t look like Christ. If you mean the pasty white long haired guy you all think is Jesus then yea he looks like him but it’s not like he’s trying to copy the look. I’m sure if Jesus was a real person he wasn’t white considering he was a Middle Eastern Jew. http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/health/forensics/1282186

            As for Dane Cook it was a funny joke. Most people don’t like him because he steals jokes from other comedians but he did have some funny moments in his career. Try some of these jokes.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF7R0NbnfBY

          • johnjohnson

            Bemused Atheist – quite the contrary, your comment is judgemental and rude

          • mary

            God trains us to judge and is the guiding force in discerning truth. You cannot do it alone which is why you are clueless when you speak.

          • Trina Macko

            It is up to you to be the judge of what is good FOR YOU and what you think is true or not. It is not for you to judge what is good for others, or impose your views on them.. nobody demands you believe in God or shoves it down your throat… Why do you feel compelled to shove your lack of belief in God down the throats of those who have belief in God.. ? I find that very puzzling.

          • NorwegianThunder

            Too bad religious people don’t take your own advice. Stop preaching, stop proselytizing, and stop indoctrinating children.

            “It is not for you to judge what is good for others, or impose your views on them” – I couldn’t agree more – and especially children who have not developed their own critical reasoning skills and have a predisposition to believe what adult authorities tell them…

            If the religious kept it at home and church there probably wouldn’t be so much fuss. Sadly though many of these people want to control and legislate my world – based on a dangerous set of myths.

            If you would stop indoctrinating children – that would be great too. Have I mentioned that already?

            I don’t shove a lack of belief in gods down anyone throat – but I will engage adults in conversations and ask difficult questions that have a tenancy to undermine the foundations of someones belief.

            Having rational and evidence based conversations is hardly shoving something down anyone’s throat.

            We [atheists] prefer a world that uses intelligence, reason, rationality, thoughtfulness, ingenuity, sincerity, science, and kindness to build the future; not a world built on faith, delusion, pretending, religion, fear, pseudoscience, superstition, or a certainty achieved by keeping people in a stupor that makes them pawns of unseen forces because they’re terrified.

          • Trina Macko

            Please read my conversations with Robert Jory.. I’m tired and going now for the night…but you say you believe in kindness to build the future? Your Christ out of Christmas advertisement in Times Square is not kind… Those who believe in Christ are not attacking YOU and atheists and ‘calling you out’ at Christmas for your non belief… seems there is a lot of hate and aggression in your intellectual approach… faith is also a fact of life.. if you are married you have faith your spouse will be faithful to your or you would not have married, you have faith you will love your child, you have faith in good friends.. all are connected to love and an invisible belief… I have faith God is real and God is good, just like you believe in your aspects of faith quoted.. so to say you do not want a world built on faith is also false.. there is always faith and belief in things the individual does not see for themselves and takes for granted… we have faith air will continue to be here and we can breathe.. and none of those beliefs make us pawns. Jesus taught love, at a time in history when life was very unkind.. he changed a lot of the world to what you believe is a definition in action of kindness, love, thoughtfulness (by teaching those to listen to his parables and think analytically and think beyond the box); much of today’s values and society are here because of Christian foundations… you may rebel against organized religion as there are many who are in churches, I grant you this, who are fools, but that does not make God not exist and all believers horrible people, or all churches negative. People do what makes them happy, they choose that on their own, they are not ‘pawns’ or robots… There is freedom of choice even in religion, you choose to believe, or not believe… freedom of choice, and we all have to take responsibility for those choices whether we believe or not… because you do not believe does not give you the right to be ‘in your face’ and inconsiderate and nasty to any segment of the population just because they disagree with you… Jesus preached love your neighbor as yourself… I don’t see that in the sign in Times Square… Why was it even necessary to spread such propaganda and like a Grinch try to ruin the holiday of others who may not share your beliefs? I guess your thinking is not very thoughtful or kind, or rational or intelligent if you did not consider that what you posted insults thousands of Americans across the USA, did you? To them, as they believe and love who Jesus is, you have insulted a family member… and that is inconsiderate indeed to mock the beliefs of others and him. All you have really done is to basically show the lack of consideration that comes with the lack of belief in Christ… Love your neighbor as yourself, he preached that, and you forgot that… you preach a false doctrine, it is not one of love and kindness, just one of division person to person and an example of hostility. Love your neighbor as yourself, respect others as you would like to be respected… stop putting down and build up instead.

          • NorwegianThunder

            Hi Trina,

            You’ve said a lot so I’ll address a couple of points and sometimes the truth isn’t kind – but it’s real.

            But let’s define a couple of things first so we’re talking about the same things.
            1. Atheist. One who support the null hypothesis. the null hypothesis is the perfect starting point to investigate the existence of pretty much anything It assumes that there is no relationship between x and y. An alternative hypothesis would posit that a relationship between x and y exists. Evidence is then reviewed and we determine whether it is sufficient to allow us to reject the null hypothesis and accept the alternative. Why is the null hypothesis so important? It keeps us intellectually honest.
            2. Faith. You are conflating the term faith with hope and trust and. The have completely different meanings. Faith is pretending to know things you don’t. Taking a leap across the probabilities to arrive at an unjustified conclusion and an empirical claim about the reality of our physical world.
            When you make a faith claim you are not simply wishing or hoping it occurred – you’re claiming it actually occurred. It’s believing without evidence. See – it’s all about how one comes to knowledge and claiming knowledge based on faith isn’t reliable and in some cases deadly.

            3. Living a logical reasoned life is under attack every day in North America and the rest of the world really. . When school districts are in court about teaching creationism as a (choke) science to barely educated people denying evolution and thinking its a debate – to dominionists who today sit in government office whose stated desires are to make the US a religious theocracy or those who look forward to the”end times” with jubilation and would push the button themselves if they could. Whack jobs like Palin and Cruze.

            I live a full, complete and very happy life completely without faith. The notion that my wife loves me isn’t a radical claim while the claim that jesus walked water and rose from the dead is a very radical claim. To equate them as equal claims isn’t intellectually honest. I trust my wife – that’s based on empirical evidence.

            So – no – I do not want a world based on faith. I want a world based on care, compassion, reason and evidence. None of these things require a belief in a divine creator of the universe. One who incidentally states that I must love him or burn in hell.

            You cherry pick all the nice parts of the bible and seem to be blind to or gently ignore the parts that don’t jive with your sensibility.

            The murder, incest, rape, genocide, infanticide, torture, hate and division. You seem like a really nice person and to me that’s because inside you are- not because of religious tenants you hold, but because you are. This also tells me that religion isn’t a source of goodness and morality because if you can pick the good parts and ignore the bad parts then there is a separate system operating here. You don’t (I assume) want to put metro death for my apostasy. Why not?

            As far as the signs go – every day I pass by a sign that say “jesus loves you” – a few locks away is a church with a massive sign that says “you can be forgiven” and then the guy on the corner with the body sign that says sinners go to hell.

            You’re all fussed about a few signs in Times Square – look around you every day.

            We don’t follow a doctrine. We claim no creed.
            *.*

          • NorwegianThunder

            Hi Trina,

            You’ve said a lot so I’ll address a couple of points and sometimes the truth isn’t kind – but it’s real.

            But let’s define a couple of things first so we’re talking about the same things.
            1. Atheist. One who support the null hypothesis. the null hypothesis is the perfect starting point to investigate the existence of pretty much anything It assumes that there is no relationship between x and y. An alternative hypothesis would posit that a relationship between x and y exists. Evidence is then reviewed and we determine whether it is sufficient to allow us to reject the null hypothesis and accept the alternative. Why is the null hypothesis so important? It keeps us intellectually honest.
            2. Faith. You are conflating the term faith with hope and trust and. The have completely different meanings. Faith is pretending to know things you don’t. Taking a leap across the probabilities to arrive at an unjustified conclusion and an empirical claim about the reality of our physical world.
            When you make a faith claim you are not simply wishing or hoping it occurred – you’re claiming it actually occurred. It’s believing without evidence. See – it’s all about how one comes to knowledge and claiming knowledge based on faith isn’t reliable and in some cases deadly.

            3. Living a logical reasoned life is under attack every day in North America and the rest of the world really. . When school districts are in court about teaching creationism as a (choke) science to barely educated people denying evolution and thinking its a debate – to dominionists who today sit in government office whose stated desires are to make the US a religious theocracy or those who look forward to the”end times” with jubilation and would push the button themselves if they could. Whack jobs like Palin and Cruze.

            I live a full, complete and very happy life completely without faith. The notion that my wife loves me isn’t a radical claim while the claim that jesus walked water and rose from the dead is a very radical claim. To equate them as equal claims isn’t intellectually honest. I trust my wife – that’s based on empirical evidence.

            So – no – I do not want a world based on faith. I want a world based on care, compassion, reason and evidence. None of these things require a belief in a divine creator of the universe. One who incidentally states that I must love him or burn in hell.

            You cherry pick all the nice parts of the bible and seem to be blind to or gently ignore the parts that don’t jive with your sensibility.

            The murder, incest, rape, genocide, infanticide, torture, hate and division. You seem like a really nice person and to me that’s because inside you are- not because of religious tenants you hold, but because you are. This also tells me that religion isn’t a source of goodness and morality because if you can pick the good parts and ignore the bad parts then there is a separate system operating here. You don’t (I assume) want to put metro death for my apostasy. Why not?

            As far as the signs go – every day I pass by a sign that say “jesus loves you” – a few locks away is a church with a massive sign that says “you can be forgiven” and then the guy on the corner with the body sign that says sinners go to hell.

            You’re all fussed about a few signs in Times Square – look around you every day.

            We don’t follow a doctrine. We claim no creed.
            *.*

          • Robert Jory

            Oh, it’s not shoved down my throat? I see Christianity every time I look at US money or hear a pledge of allegiance. Every time I hear about homosexuals fighting for the basic right to marriage I hear religious hate telling them they are sinners and going to hell because of their love. And you wonder why I argue against religion. Pfft. No point arguing with a zealot.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Knowing that you believe a lie is not as comforting as some people want others to believe. Mostly it just causes a bunch of people to get a chip on their shoulder when you remind them of their lies and wasted lives.

          • mary

            Knowing? You. Knowing? LOL.

          • BemusedAtheist

            Yeah except it’s offensive to atheists as well.

          • Robert Jory

            How exactly is saying “Nobody Needs Christ at Christmas” offensive to you as an atheist?

          • johnjohnson

            I find it amazing – how much controversy comes from the name of Christ…makes one wonder why? What is it about that name that requires a billboard to slander the name?

          • mary

            Jealousy.

          • johnjohnson

            Jealousy?

          • mary

            You’re no atheist. Atheists aren’t so insecure as to spend all their time arguing about God–only those who believe He exists fight against Him. You are a more properly called a Heathen–an uncivilized and barbaric human being who has no respect for his fellow man’s culture, beliefs or values.

          • Robert Jory

            I have respect for people but there is no reason I must respect their cult of human sacrifice. By fighting against the evil of your cult I’m showing people they don’t have to follow lies.

          • Luis

            For someone who claims not to believe in God, I am suprised to see you quoting his Holy Scriptures. Christians do forgive their enemies, just as Jesus forgives you your sins if you will repent and serve him only. He loves you, and has an eternal home for you if you will accept him. Until you do, he as a Righteous God must judge you as you are…An Unrepentant Sinner and place you where you belong. In Hell forever! There are only two options for you, With God the Father, our Lord Jesus Christ, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit in the communion of the saints in Heaven forever, or condemned to eternal torment in the pit of Hell with Satan forever wihout any hope of repreve. The choice is yours my friend. I pray the Lord will open your eyes to the truth before it is too late for you. I wish that no one ever has to go to that terrible place, Please draw near to the Lord and he will draw near to you. You still have time to repent and be saved.

          • Robert Jory

            Do you not understand what you just typed? You said I have to serve this tyrant or be punished forever. That is a dictatorship. Your god is nothing more than Kim Jong in North Korea. Serve me or face torture! Sorry, that’s not free will. If those are my other two options I’d rather be in hell with the nice people.

          • johnjohnson

            That was a funny comment lol However, your free will and right is to not to believe in God…so when you die, you will either be right or wrong. 50/50 chance. Hope you have chosen wisely :)

          • Robert Jory

            I suppose if I wanted to believe in religion as insurance I’d have to believe in all the many thousands of them that man has made up. Not so much 50/50 anymore.

          • NorwegianThunder

            It’s not a 50/50 chance though. Just because I can’t disprove that there isn’t a teapot orbiting the sun – or a divine creator of the universe doesn’t mean the odds are even. The solution is binary – but not the odd.

            Possibility doesn’t equate to even probabilities.

          • mary

            You must be a teenage boy. One who never did his homework or read his history. One who is obviously not educated enough to know the difference between benevolance and malevolence.

          • Robert Jory

            I understand it quite well. The Christian god as read in the bible is very malevolent. To create people and then force them with an ultimatum is not benevolent in the least. At least in North Korea when you die Kim Jong can’t hurt you anymore. God wants to be a dick to you for eternity.

          • Trina Macko

            If you believe in a hell, then you believe in an after life… and if there is a hell, then there is a heaven… examine what you just said… so you must believe in God and heaven and hell on some level.. but hell is hell.. and if it does exist, I doubt the nice people are there… I think a bit of afterlife insurance would be to explore the Bible and other religious texts that talk about God… just a thought.

          • Robert Jory

            You obviously don’t understand what I was saying. You took it to mean I actually believe in hell, which I don’t. Sorry you misunderstood.
            As for afterlife insurance I’m surprised you insult your god like that. To think that this all power being you imagine is running everything you’d think he could figure out if someone really believes in him or is just doing it for a free trip to heaven.
            It is truly sad if your only reason for being good is to be in heaven instead of hell.

          • Trina Macko

            No, Robert… I’m not being ‘good’ so I go to heaven.. actually, as a Christian I’m remiss… I should with certainty believe I’m going to heaven, but as a flawed human being often wonder if in my failings I am pleasing God… but I hope as he is forgiving he will forgive me and allow me closeness with him, which is heaven after death. To me conversion to Christianity was to find a better and more effective, less damaging, way of life for myself and to live towards others… Life is never easy, but I’m a lot happier by using Jesus as a model for behavior in terms of what he taught… life has gone better for me since I have tried to model myself after him… If, as you say, this life is all there is, then at least I will have had that, a decent life I can be proud of and feel good about, and hope I have done good in and for others given something. For some people, that alone would be enough, but for me I do it to model someone I feel is far superior to me and knows more than I do, and I find the teaching works… Jesus was a great psychologist, really. But if one believed in heaven, wouldn’t it be foolish NOT to hope to get there? Some Christian groups think you get to heaven by good behavior, many born again Christians believe that you get to heaven, and close to God in this world, just by believing in him.. and you do the right thing because of your belief, because you love and revere him and out of respect and seeing the rightness of those teachings, you just want to please and realize it’s the best way to live your life… It seems you have a lot of impressions of ‘shoulds’ associated with how God is supposed to be and wants or teaches people to be… I got those as a kid too, and rebelled and wanted nothing to do with church or organized religion or God… finally I realized a lot of that teaching was very wrong after study and thinking…. Jesus came to clarify what we knew about God, and reshape it to a more loving and realistic perspective, many don’t realize there are lessons in the Old Testament, but that was only a partial reveal of what God is, the more full revelation came through Jesus as he showed us more who he is and who his Father is… People in the Old Testament were not ready for that revelation in those times.. finally they were to a degree when he came about.. But God must civilize every new human from birth to death… Society has progressed, but each person must be worked and move towards greater refinement as they grow and age, hopefully… there is an over arching plan.

          • Trina Macko

            But if we cannot have love, what else is there? The opposite which is hate? So I choose the best model I think I can find to teach me about that love and love better than I can comprehend, I strive to learn it and hope I improve myself day by day, and at times feel I often fail miserably, but I keep on keeping on, with ups and downs, and hope he understands. But if I honestly work to be the very best I can be, and say I’m sorry when I’m lazy, which happens, hopefully he will say ‘job well done’ at the end of my life, and that is all I really need or want.

          • Robert Jory

            You can get all that peace and harmony with others from Buddhism which teaches there are no gods but self enlightenment. Why must there be a god or even Jesus to see how to help people live better lives? Can you not tell the difference between suffering and well being without the guidance of Jesus?
            There are a lot of things the bible says to do or not to do and people pick and choose which ones to follow. It’s supposed to be the word of your god yet people can interpret it however they want. To me that says it’s man made and people can mold it to their needs. Luckily for me more and more people are becoming atheist.

          • Trina Macko

            I think Buddhists believe in God.. I may be wrong.. I never studied the teachings of Buddhism in detail, so I can’t fairly comment on that… I don’t think there has to be a God, I just believe in a God. And because of the teachings, hopefully of love, it makes sense to me… and, really no, unless I am missing what you are saying, to me in the midst of suffering I see no well being, I’m incapable of seeing it while suffering as you don’t feel that well being… so most need a ‘something’ to pull them out of that suffering and have hope. Having hope in something better, and learning a philosophy or teaching that gave me that hope and allowed me to rise up gave me better well being… the teaching that did that for me was that of Jesus… so I believe in him… And, ultimately, we are in our own private relationship with God and responsible for that relationship on our own.. if we interpret, that is between God and ourselves… people do interpret the Bible differently.. the only two I find cast in concrete are again, Love your God with all your heart and mind and love your neighbor as yourself… If you do all of that you are, to me, living up to the Bible and it’s intentions. And that is between me and God.. but just cause someone else believes it differently and fire and brimstone doesn’t make me not believe in him cause their teachings are painful and I see them as crazy… I just think they are nut bags and have their won relationship with God… they will either have the truth revealed to him as he wants it, but their beliefs seem to be unloving, which makes me think they are wrong… I’m not at war with them, or atheists… I just disagree, and hope I’m doing what I think my God would want me to do… I learned from the teachings I believe in, think I’m a better person because of it, and live and let live.. but that doesn’t make my belief any less valid than anyone else’s. My beliefs give meaning to my life, and I feel at peace… it’s all I wish for anyone else, that peace and lack of turmoil. Why is it lucky for you more and more are becoming atheist? I felt lost when I didn’t believe… and had severe doubts… If you don’t believe you are not the oddity, there have always been those who choose not to believe. Sometimes they change to become a person who believes, sometimes not… but they are all equal as people.

          • Trina Macko

            Really, I feel blessed that I do believe, but I am not a BETTER person in regards to other people and worth more as a person because of that belief in terms of the world… I meant to say above ‘I just think they are nut bags and have their OWN relationship with God (I said OWN, it was a typo, sorry)… I’m not competing with you as an atheist, Robert, just want to live and let live… and if I can give anything, give it… not take away something… but I think the sign ‘take Jesus out of Christmas’ takes something away from those who believe.. it makes fun of them, and it’s hurtful… can you understand that part? They love and respect Jesus as a living person and as if a family member cause he is always in their minds and parts of their lives, so it’s like beating up on their father or brother.. so they feel insulted. I think atheists have to see it from their side as well and be understanding and give some politeness and courtesy.

          • Trina Macko

            And I wish you and all of your fellows a happy month of December and New Year’s in this season of holiday celebrations… May you receive all good things and peace for this year and the year to come…

          • Robert Jory

            This billboard is saying that the traditions of Christmas are not about Jesus at all. They are pagan traditions adopted by the Catholic church that were practiced long before Jesus was born. How is showing people the truth of Christmas, that they practice, insulting? If I was taught to do something I would like to know it’s origins. They definitely aren’t Christian.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLjHAzqqOm0

          • Trina Macko

            The bill board does not mention these traditions of the past as far as I know… Feb. 14 is valentine’s day, that came first, my mom’s birthday is Feb. 14th, should we take the mom out of Feb 14th? If the government makes the 4th of July a national holiday, is it not valid cause they made it up…? If I celebrate my birthday on a different day of the week than the actual day of my birthday, is my party invalid? Sorry, when you have nothing nice to say, it’s better to say nothing instead of pick an argument where you know it will incite one.. it’s not kind.

          • Trina Macko

            The sign/billboard is not a tool to teach about Dec. 25 traditions, just to attempt to remove the traditions of others…

          • Trina Macko

            Anyhow, I know and lots of people know about old traditions and pagan traditions.. I doubt they care, they want to celebrate the birth of Jesus and have chosen that day to do it.. I don’t know the birthday of my dog, either, and though the dog is not as important as Jesus, certainly, I picked a day to celebrate with bones for her.. is that less an important day cause I don’t know when she was born? No, it’s important to ME. You guys are just Grinches.

          • Robert Jory

            Everyone knows Jesus, if he was even real, was not born in December. The Catholic Church just wanted to invalidate all other pagan celebrations so they took over the winter solstice. Your mom is a real person so she can celebrate her birthday when ever she wants. Most people have jobs so it’s common for people to have parties on the weekend even if it’s not their birthday. Historians suspect Jesus, if real, would have been born in the Fall, months before the winter solstice. Speaking of holidays, all federal holidays have something to do with the history of our nation, Independence Day, Veteran’s Day, Memorial Day, Washington’s Birthday. Yet for some reason Christmas is a federal holiday. It has nothing to do with our history. Other Christian holidays aren’t federal holidays. Just another example of our government forcing Christianity on everyone, like our currency and Pledge of Allegiance.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            Great Video….problem is, most Christians won’t watch it because “it is all made up anyway” lol
            I think they are afraid of listening to anything that may change their mind…like Satan is using it to his evil means.
            I say, if you can’t listen to anything like this then your faith isn’t very strong if you are afraid it will sway you away from Christianity.

          • Robert Jory

            I didn’t make the video but I agree it is a good one. Religious people will always make up reasons to fit their faith. It’s almost pointless to argue with them but at least on here many will see it and the people on the fence will hopefully see reason. Those that are strong in their superstitions will at least have tiny seeds of doubt that will one day grow into skepticism.
            We don’t want any more 9/11 events from Islam or abortion doctors shot by Christians. One day the bible will be seen as only literature and not as literal.

          • Robert Jory

            A lot of people feel lost when they don’t believe and the latch on to the first thing that accepts them. Religion will accept you, long as you give money to their church and follow their rules. To not be under the heel of religion is to be truly free. Knowing you can ask questions without people becoming defensive or giving you dirty looks, to know you are in control of your life and not some invisible man in the sky. There is hope for the world and it is the end of religion. That scares religious people the same way freedom scares lifetime convicts. To be set free without someone controlling every aspect of your life can be scary but is comfort worth oppression? No, it is not. Many people are freeing their minds and lives from the prison of religion and are the better for it.

            http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2013/12/13/ethiopia-utopia-a-village-finds-wealth-without-religion-can-you-guess-how-its-devout-neighbors-reacted/

          • Trina Macko

            well, right now I don’t really fellowship at a church cause most are young families and it’s hard for me to make connections and feel a part of, particularly as they are such large congregations… the church I loved the best is across country from where I live now, and only 250 people, and I loved it, so I guess others pale in comparison… I accepted Jesus in that church, and was grateful for their emotional support and kindness, but gave no real money nor were they rule bound… they accepted me even as I was NOT exactly biblical in my behavior in those years.. it took me time, but nobody rejected me, which was why I stayed. I don’t feel out of control of my life in regards to God or under his heel or resent the ‘yoke’, as it says it’s easy and light. As far as the hope for the world being the end of religion, I don’t think that will occur, respectfully stated. Lots of people need something to believe in them and to believe in that is benevolent and kind, and government won’t do it… Communists might have felt that religion was the opiate of the people, but in Russia religion is back after a long time.. in N. Korea they kill you for having a Bible, but I can’t say they are better off under that regime. If you feel relief this way, with saying you have felt you are throwing off shackles, it’s cause you felt shackled.. I don’t feel that way, in fact now I’m grateful.. I felt that way once, that I could not have a good time in life and do as I wanted, but over time I’ve come to see it’s no effort to be more like Jesus, I don’t feel deprived, just at peace and relieved. Sorry churches and Christianity, if that is what you are referring to, was so painful for you… it’s not like that for everyone though…

          • johnjohnson

            Good point! Matter of fact…the more the Christian’s are ridiculed, the stronger their faith becomes

          • Robert Jory

            But the ones on the fence about religion end up jumping over to the atheist side. Atheism is the fastest growing demographic in the US.

          • Trina Macko

            Issue is, WHY do you care if people don’t believe? What do you get out of it? People who believe in Jesus feel good in telling others about him because he stated they should do that… they have a belief they want to follow in his footsteps and do as he has commanded.. who is commanding you to spread atheism, and why? Is there an unending reward for converting someone to not believing in God… a payoff? For Christians the payoff is heaven, what is yours?

          • Robert Jory

            There is a payoff: a little more sanity in the world. I don’t like cults of human sacrifice being spread to helpless children.

          • Trina Macko

            LOL, you make it sound like people are being sacrificed on an altar and small helpless children are forced to witness blood and gore.. you know that’s not true.. there is no ‘human sacrifice’ at an altar as in the methods of the Mayans at the tops of pyramids… Jesus was taken by hostile and uncivilized troops, unfairly tried, did not defend himself and gave himself up to those unfair proceedings, and died as a result of that… showing by example how terrible his persecutors were and trying to show kids and adults alike that it’s not the way to live… things happen in the world with executions and legal proceedings all the time… we hope they are just today, but probably not all the time. Because of what he taught and preached, his death was different as he wanted to transform humanity to be more humane.. how is that terrible for children? It’s actually heroism in the realm of humanity… just depends on how you look at it, Robert.

          • Robert Jory

            But there is human sacrifice in the bible. When god tells Abraham to sacrifice his son to him and stops him right before he does it. Can you imagine the trauma that child suffered from that? Can you imagine someone doing that today? People have said god told them to kill their children and they do. This is what religion makes possible.
            In Exodus 13:2 the Lord said “Consecrate to me every first-born that opens the womb among Israelites, both man and beast, for it belongs to me.”

            God loves to kill children. Especially first born children. Who could love a god that kills babies?

            Leviticus 27
            28 Notwithstanding no devoted thing, that a man shall devote unto the Lord of all that he hath, both of man and beast, and of the field of his possession, shall be sold or redeemed: every devoted thing is most holy unto the Lord.
            29 None devoted, which shall be devoted of men, shall be redeemed; but shall surely be put to death.

            Judges 11:29-40
            “At that time the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah, and he went throughout the land of Gilead and Manasseh, including Mizpah in Gilead, and led an army against the Ammonites. And Jephthah made a vow to the LORD. He said, “If you give me victory over the Ammonites, I will give to the LORD the first thing coming out of my house to greet me when I return in triumph. I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering.”

            The first thing to come out of his house upon returning was his daughter who he burned as a sacrifice to god.

            1 Kings 13:1-2
            At the LORD’s command, a man of God from Judah went to Bethel, and he arrived there just as Jeroboam was approaching the altar to offer a sacrifice. Then at the LORD’s command, he shouted, “O altar, altar! This is what the LORD says: A child named Josiah will be born into the dynasty of David. On you he will sacrifice the priests from the pagan shrines who come here to burn incense, and human bones will be burned on you.”

            But yea… there is no human sacrifice. Try reading your own bible. I can give you more examples if you want.

          • Trina Macko

            These are all in the Old Testament, Robert… I believe that the Old testament and New Testament work as a gradual revelation from God to us as he revealed his nature to us.. in the Old Testament days people WERE very warlike, and worshipped idols, and had multiple wives, and did all kinds of ugly things… But a messiah (Jesus) would have not been needed if the people were fine and good enough as they were, or capable of understanding.. they were not, so Jesus had to come to teach more… Jesus doesn’t preach killing babies… the best preaching and teaching is at the end of the book, and the best and most up to date we have about God so far (in my faith)… Those Old Testament guys were pretty mixed up dudes in my mind.. they needed to clean up their acts, and Jesus came to try to tell them that and to try to teach them that.. Remember the Pharisees? They preached Old Testament, and he tried to set them straight… but of course they didn’t want to listen and ended up working to kill him… He taught, they didn’t believe, but it didn’t make him wrong, just made them out of step and wrong… they were so legalistic they wanted to have people be ‘rule bound’ .. He basically just said ‘love your god with all your heart and mind, and love your neighbor as yourself’ are all that’s important and that all else proceeds forward from those two principles.. stupid Pharisees didn’t even get the point. For them stoning sinners in the marketplace and vilifying women who might have a disease was just fine… not to Jesus… he told a crowd to ‘cast the first stone’ if they were not guilty of anything, and in shame they could not (treat others as yourselves), he talked to women in public when it was not acceptable to do so in those days, and let a diseased woman touch him which was taboo and would have made him unclean, again he loved first and did not apply stupid rules… But he never told anyone to sacrifice a child or the life of another.. I pity the kid in the Old Testament who was almost sacrificed, very barbaric; Jesus would not have done that.. as I said, he said ‘woe is to you who would hurt one of these little ones’… HE was not for that! The old testament lesson that was taught about the sacrifice of the child being partially acted out was supposed to be one of showing that Abraham would do anything God asked to please him and had faith in God to know that God would always work things for good… how God handled the mental peace of the child I have no idea.. maybe the child was unaware, let us hope so, cause nothing is really said about the kid in that way that I remember… hopefully a merciful God would not have traumatized the kid… But JESUS would never ask anyone to do that and never did… And the child with Abraham was not killed, God did not allow that, so I think there is more there I don’t know… (something for me to research) However, I know Jesus came with a different message, so I look at the Old Testament as a base and background and history for his teachings, but they are not to be followed by rote. Not with his arrival. He said the rules of the Old Testament existed, but should be tempered with love, which the Pharisees and Jews of that time were not doing… maybe Abraham should have said ‘God, kill me instead of ask me to kill my child, because I cannot be so unloving to him as to take his life’… What would God had said then? I know what JESUS would have said.. He would have said, ‘good job’, you passed the love test, that’ s what I think.

          • Trina Macko

            I find this interesting, Robert.. I see God as being one of love and preaching love, why do you see it as the opposite? My comment is not meant as a criticism of you, I just wonder why? It took me a long time to believe, it did not happen in an instant, far from it, and I at times have doubts about God being there for me often.. I waffle, but mostly I stay on the same path… I never believe God to be mean, though, merely just, and I hope his sense of justice allows for my imperfections… I just have to go on faith.. and that is the issue… faith being belief in things not seen… I had to seek out what I thought was the truth, got to a certain point, had no concrete proof, but felt compelled to make that leap of faith even on circumstantial evidence (if you want to call it that) cause it all just made sense… nothing else seemed to fit or seem reasonable to me… sorry I can’t explain it better.

          • NorwegianThunder

            I think what you are saying is that your faith is true for you. Regardless of how the world really is and you admit to that in your comment above.

            Faith traditions includes statements, empirical claims, of fact about the world – then what you are saying is that your belief is true for you, regardless of how the world actually is.

            Since the world is the way it is regardless of your beliefs or of the epistemology we use to know the world the position that “my faith is true for me” is nonsense.

            I can have “faith” that if I jump out of a window that I’ll polymorph into an eagle and fly away. This does not make it the case.

            What you are really saying when you claim that your faith is true for you is that you prefer you delusions and wish to remain with them in spite of the evidence.

            for some reason you seem to feel that taking that leap of faith is virtuous.

            It seems you started out with the alternate hypothesis – took the data as far as you could – seeking the conclusion you want and in the end when it didn’t all fit together you were already invested in this hypothesis (god exists) that you just leap over the gap anyways.

            This is called the god of the gaps – you say it yourself “nothing else seemed to fit”.

            What about the alternate and say either “I don’t know” or acknowledge the fact that your evidence doesn’t support your conclusion?

            It’s okay to not know.

          • Robert Jory

            Let’s read some quotes from your hero Jesus.

            Matthew 10:34-37
            Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword.
            For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
            And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household.
            He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.

            So you must love god and Jesus more than your family or he’ll make you kill each other. What a swell guy.

            Matthew 11:20-30 Jesus condemns a city to death and suffering in hell all because they didn’t believe him. No room for forgiveness I guess.

            Revelations 19:13-15 A Jesus covered in blood calling himself the Word of God leads armies from heaven to smite the nations and rule us with a rod of iron. Sounds like paradise.

            You can look all of these up in your bible by the way.

            Matthew 13:10 His disciples ask him why he speaks in parables and Jesus says it’s so his followers can understand him and receive salvation and those unworthy will not understand. Again in Mark 4:11-12 Jesus tells his followers he speaks in parables so they will know but others will hear and not understand because if they did they would be converted and be forgiven. Jesus wouldn’t want them to be saved so he confuses them to keep them in sin and going to hell. Never a kinder man than Jesus.

            You mentioned the Pharisees right? In Matthew 15 Jesus and his followers go before the Pharisees and they ask him why him and his followers didn’t wash their hands before eating. Jesus asks them why they don’t kill children who don’t honor their parents. So because they don’t follow his rules he doesn’t follow theirs.

            Matthew 19:29 Jesus says if you abandon your house and family and children for him he will reward you. So neglect is a good thing according to Jesus.

            Mark 4:25 Jesus says those who have stuff will have more upon death and those that have nothing will have even more taken away. Such an advocate for the poor.

            Mark 11:13 Jesus goes to a fig tree out of season and seeing it was not bearing fruit he yells at the tree that no man shall ever eat it’s fruit. Having a tantrum and yelling at a tree. Was he a bit special perhaps?

            As you can see flaws can be found even in your superhero Jesus. WWJD? Who knows? He couldn’t seem to make up his own mind if he was good or not.

          • Trina Macko

            After you posted all these (wow, have you researched!) I’m going to look up these texts you give, interesting challenge for me to understand… but don’t take the words literally, they have to be taken in context of other beliefs and texts, I know not literally… I do know when he said he came with a sword to separate brother from brother and families what he meant was that there would be separation as those who believed in him in families would be estranged from those who did not believe.. as today it would cause arguments for a variety of reasons, and the separation I take as a sword, nobody was being ordered to kill family, and I know of no examples where they did and he condoned it. Matthew 19:29 about the stuff means that those who have belief will have more security in God and company with him (which he feels has more value than material goods) and those who have nothing (lack of belief) will be losing everything, and not have that gold or presence with him as their belief in itself does not let them into his company (how can you be in the company of something you say does not exist? I mean, if you don’t believe it’s real you won’t recognize it)… So he’s not taking from the poor, he was always FOR the poor and preached to give to the poor, I’m sure you know that… I think with the fig tree, he thought that the tree should recognize God (in him and that he was god) but it did not, so he cursed it.. don’t understand that, but I’m going to study it.. in that he was god, he was special, really. I think in Matthew 15 he’s saying that it’s ridiculous to wash hands before meals, and it’s as logical and as required as to kill kids if they don’t obey their parents.. I don’t think it’s that it was a neener neener about you don’t obey my rules I don’t follow yours.. there must have been something in their behavior or rules intrinsically that was wrong he was pointing out.. I’ll have to look at it… Interesting points, Richard, but always remember context and to think about the love of the situation that should be in it… he said, and I repeat, love your god with all your hear and your neighbor as yourself.. if it seems his statement in another part of the bible contradicts that, look for another interpretation of that section, cause those two statements about god and love are the absolutes.

          • Cameron Durham

            How do you not see that these texts were written to control the populace? All over the place I see the “don’t take it literally” argument, and to that I say, then how are we supposed to ever find the truth if it’s different for everyone? There are so many interpretations of the bible because the text is very unclear in its meaning. Even if the bible is 100% accurate, how do you know what it is telling you?

          • Mary

            Dear children! Today I call all of you to prayer. Open the doors of your heart profoundly to prayer, little children, to prayer with the heart; and then the Most High will be able to act upon your freedom and conversion will begin. Your faith will become firm so that you will be able to say with all your heart: ‘My God, my all.’ You will comprehend, little children, that here on earth everything is passing. Thank you for having responded to my call.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            I don’t understand how someone can use the Bible to prove a point when the Bible was made up by Constantine and his merry men at Nicaea ….there is NO point in quoting it.

          • Robert Jory

            It’s the only reason for these delusional people to believe in Christianity so you use what they think is true against them. I don’t believe any of the book.

          • Tess Dommer

            Brilliant Trina. Excellent post. Two Thumbs up!!!!!!!!

          • Tess Dommer

            LOL Robert do you realize how illogical your post is? You say the payoff of being an atheist is that it will bring more sanity to the world. Tell us based on FACT and not your FEELINGS just what it is you mean by that statement.
            Do you really believe that people of Faith belong to cults and sacrifice humans to our GOD and that we terrorize children?
            Here’s a thought Robert. YOU and others of your ilk don’t have the right to make decisions for us Christians or tell us how to raise our children. You don’t have the authority or the power. Look. Why don’t you just live your life denying GOD and leave the majority of us who do alone. What business is it of yours who believes what and why? If you want respect than you have to earn it but if you think by being mean spirited and insulting to others who celebrate Christmas or Easter or any other HOLIDAY aka HOLY DAY than expect to get what you dish out ten fold. The reality is that without GOD your life is meaningless. That is not an OPINION but a FACT. Think about it or are you so intolerant and close minded that you can only regurgitate what you have been told? Wise Up.

          • Robert Jory

            Your post really makes me sad. That someone could be so brainwashed as you are is also really scary.
            It is kind of funny though that you say we can’t make decisions for you yet you want to make decisions for everyone else. You can’t have everything your way. Your post sounds like a child who has to share and is throwing a tantrum. The US government is not supposed to go with the majority if the minority is having rights taken away. Denying homosexuals the right to marriage is doing just that. Denying them from seeing their loved one in a hospital because they are not legally married is doing just that. Having “In God We Trust” on our currency is taking away my freedom from religion. Having god in the Pledge of Allegiance is taking away my freedom from religion. Can you not see how you are forcing your faith on others but get so butt hurt when people want their views to be respected as well? You have to earn respect, isn’t that what you just posted? Right now you’re not earning it by being a bigot. Easter is about kids hunting for eggs hidden by the Easter Bunny. No one cares that the charlatan Jesus tricked people into thinking he rose from the dead. Christmas is about spending time with family and sharing gifts. No one cares that Jesus wasn’t even born during the winter solstice or that the bible lies about where he was born, if he was even a real person.

            You have so much hate but that is to be expected when your faith is questioned. You have your own doubts and instead of looking at them critically you lash out and ignore the true facts. Life is beautiful without the spiteful, jealous, cruel god of the Christian cult of human sacrifice. We are good without the fear of punishment or need for reward. Without your god you’d probably run around killing people and raping children. Good thing you fear an imaginary place of fire so the children are safe.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            My payoff for being an atheist is knowing that I am in control of my life. I can make decisions using reason instead of religion.

          • Tess Dommer

            Excellent post. You’re so very right. I love the part **** and I quote:

            Who is commanding you to spread atheism, and why? Is there an unending reward for converting someone to not believing in God… a payoff? For Christians the payoff is heaven, what is yours?
            I wonder if Robert can logically answer your questions.

          • mary

            Actually, the Bible tells people to recognize and judge evil for what is is.

          • Robert Jory

            Judge not lest you be judged.

          • mary

            Let’s be real. Every moment of every day is spent making judgments. Based on our judgments, we make decisions, Based on our decisions we take action. Based on our action, we either take responsibility or we don’t. We all judge people based on their actions. That’s how we know who to avoid and who to approach.
            A continual series of action that is offensive, hurtful to others, mean-spirited and cruel is a signal that that person is no good. Why is not for me to judge. That good exists in that person is for me to find because it’s never too late for anyone to realize the choices made are destroying his own nature, not mine.

          • Robert Jory

            “A continual series of action that is offensive, hurtful to others, mean-spirited and cruel is a signal that that person is no good.”
            That is exactly why I steer clear of religion. It’s followers are usually all of those things disguised as kindness and love. God loves you, unless you’re gay, tattooed, working on Saturday, think your neighbor’s wife is attractive, say his name with a shitty attitude, eat pork, and much more. Your god is the one that tells you not to judge but you just proved that everyone judges. Guess we’re all hellbound.

          • mary

            I said, “A continual series of action that is offensive, hurtful to others, mean-spirited and cruel is a signal that that person is no good.”

            So you have a problem with people judging you by your cruel actions? Who wants to be around a cruel, mean person. That has nothing to do with religion. If you’re sadistic and are happy, that means you get joy from hurting others. That’s a problem. Maybe not for you, but for people who don’t like being hurt, it is.

            You said, “God loves you, unless you’re gay, tattooed, working on Saturday, think your neighbor’s wife is attractive, say his name with a shitty attitude, eat pork, and much more.”

            Where did you get the idea that God loves those people less? Those people choose their own paths. God is always there to help them back from harm’s way–just like your own family would be.

            You are filled with a spirit of hatred and resentment.
            We, of course, all judge. Man will judge the angels. One cannot judge the mind of another man who has fallen into sin, but his actions will always be judged by everyone on the planet.

          • Robert Jory

            If I feel any hate it’s towards a cult of hate and bigotry called Christianity and most other religious cults as well. You misunderstood my last comment. I was saying religious people are offensive, hurtful to others and mean-spirited and cruel and disguise it with their claim of love while they still hate on homosexual people or other religions or the nonreligious. If you want to see proof of your imaginary god’s hate look at Leviticus 20:13: “If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.” Your bible is saying to kill anyone who is homosexual. Your god is always there to help them? Then why do millions of babies die in third world countries without a chance to survive? Is pain and suffering just part of you asshole god’s plan?

            Religion is so disgusting it makes me sick. What’s worse is people like you defending it. No better than a person defending a rapist who hurts children. Which I might add happens a lot in the safety of religious churches.

          • mary

            Homosexual priests molested teenage boys and that was horrific. Homosexuals prey on children at schools, as coaches, as music tutors, in playgrounds etc. It’s not a new story. Read your fairy tales. They warn about the existence of predators looking for children. Human sex trafficking is horrific. It happens in the United States. So let’s stop pretending that it’s the Catholic Church with the problem. It’s a problem with people who have no self-control over their own sexual desires nor do they think they need to have self-control.
            You go on to say a rapist in the Church. there is little to no evidence that rape took place. Most was molesting–with teenage boys and men in homosexual acts. Anal sex was not mentioned so let’s stop the exaggeration unless you want to actually read the facts and have a conversation. Somehow I doubt that you’d bother with facts.
            You have no clue what the Bible, religion, God, the world, life and death are about.
            You are not a child. You are a grown man. How did you allow your thinking to become so warped?
            People die. That’s a part of life. People break their legs. Trees fall. Animals get hit by cars. You blame this all on God? Are you looking for what?
            You don’t want to be judged when you’re mean. You don’t think anyone has a right to tell you you’re wrong. No one should judge you period. Hey, brother, you have a superiority complex. You think you are better than everyone and you got there by justifying actions that you were told were wrong and you defied someone you hated to get even with them. Well, now you won. Congratulations. God does still love you, and there’s still time. Don’t take what you did out on the rest of us. You chose to do what you did out of spite and because you refuse to admit that, you hate the Church, you hate God because you hate yourself.

          • Robert Jory

            Yes, there are sexual predators in other places but the Catholic Church doesn’t punish it’s priests for their crimes, they protect them. They transfer them to other countries and other churches where they will just do it all over again.
            Actually rape does happen in churches. Maybe not a priest on a boy. Look up the youtube series “what religion has contributed this month” and you’ll see all the news stories of church leaders or teachers raping adolescent girls that they are supposed to be helping. They might not all be Catholic but they are still organized religion.
            I only blame your god for everything bad because that’s how your cult is taught. Everything is part of your god’s plan so that must mean all the bad shit too, right? Or do you also cherry pick only the good stuff and say ‘god is mysterious’ for anything bad? Religion claims they know exactly what happens after death, I say I don’t know. Who’s more childish?
            I don’t think I’m better than anyone. Not sure where you’re getting that idea. But I am nice to people just to be nice to them because I would like to be treated the same way. I do not cater to an invisible man who will punish me if I don’t act the way he wants me to. Doing something because it’s kind is much better than doing it for a reward in an afterlife or fear of punishment.
            Atheism is the fastest growing demographic in the US. Most other countries are already way ahead of us. All it takes is time for people to learn.

          • mary

            I think you know nothing about Catholicism. Yes we know what happens after death. It’s not “religion” that claims that. Christ was God. He told us what happens and rose from the dead. We are kind for the same reason you are. We are not continually thinking of the afterlife. Nor are we always thinking of an invisible man. God is a bit larger than that. We believe in the Blessed Mother having a place of honor in heaven, we believe people have become saints, and we believe there’s a devil. We believe in philosophical determinants that have a basis in logic, we believe miracles happen every day, we don’t pray to saints or the Blessed Mother, but ask their intercession on our behalf and ask they pray for us. We pray for the dead.
            We see truth quite clearly and are not befuddled by manipulative schemes designed to mislead. They are obvious to us. We have great patience because we know there are people who cannot see the truth as clearly as we and that is who we refer to as blind.
            I know it may be a lot for you to digest. I remember being where you are. I didn’t believe anything. It was all quite ridiculous. The world was reality and those religious people were living in lala land and were hypocrites to boot. Some may be, most are not.
            So, I’ve read and read and read. I struggled and read. I questioned and read. And then I saw. Very clearly what reality is. It’s hard to explain because to me it’s right before all our eyes but I remember not being able to see anything as clearly as I do now.

            So read. Read CS Lewis–Narnia. The lion is Christ. You need to read the four gospels. Watch the movie The story of Fatima–it’s from the 1950′s. Watch the song of bernadette. Watch the Scarlet and the Black. watch the movie The Mission. Read Frank Sheed’s Theology and Sanity–very difficult. Read Cardinal Sheehan’s dissertation God and Intelligence in Modern Man. Watch his lectures on youtube. You can laugh. You can question. You should question. Then you should look for the answers. There are answers to every question and then more questions–unlike school where your curiousity was shut down.
            So, good luck. Take care. God Bless.

          • Robert Jory

            Sorry soon as I read that second sentence “Yes we know what happens after death” I stopped reading. You are obviously batshit crazy and I’m not going to waste my time. No one ‘knows’ what happens after death, especially not some bronze age superstitious brutes. Good bye.

          • mary

            Wow. You must live in a very small little world. You are unable to continue reading and curse at me. You are well aware that there are people who believe in God and for good reason. You have never read anything except atheistic material because you are narrow minded. You’re also afraid because you can’t get past your own condemnation of God.

          • Robert Jory

            I’m actually very open minded. I’d looked into a lot of the main religions and if I had to pick one I’d go with Buddhism but it’s not needed so I don’t bother following it. You don’t seem to understand how arrogant and delusional you sound when you say you KNOW what happens after death. All you know is what an old book tells you. The bible is not the word of god, it’s the word of men, as is every other holy book.

            The people who are afraid are those that need this reassurance that there is more after this life. We know life is short and it scares the shit out of you so you grab at anything that tells you there’s more to it. Even if they are only fairy tales you feel safer believing in them. If you used logic you’d see that there is no proof of god or an afterlife. One book doesn’t cut it. Grab any book off a shelf in a library and it will have more valid, useful information in it than your bible.

            What exactly is there in human history about the bronze age that would make me suddenly believe they were smarter than we are now? There is no reason to follow rules they made up then. Ever human rights controversy in the US history has had to fight against people using the bible to justify their cruel behavior. Black Americans being slaves was defended with the bible, women not having rights, and now homosexuals right to marry. Always the bible fighting people’s basic human rights.

            My conscience is part of my mind and is located in my brain. Not sure where you were going with that.

            There’s no real point to this argument, though. You’ve lived under the heel of your delusion and nothing I type in this forum will change your belief in imaginary friends that grant wishes.

          • yosemitedave

            So you want to go slap somebody because they’re suppose to turn their other cheek? You’re an asshole then.

          • Trina Macko

            Wow, you want to have it both ways… say the Bible is right and that people who believe in God are wrong… People who object are those who object when you criticize family, to them their church IS family… do you let people b beat up, verbally, on the ‘idea’ your brother, mother, sister or father is a good person? You are being hateful and inconsiderate of the sensitivities of others.. just live and let live.

          • Robert Jory

            I would be fine if religious views were not the basis for some laws such as homosexuals not getting married. If religion was an internal thing that you believed and kept to yourself I’d be all for it and they could all do it but it’s not. They love to tell everyone that they are right and everyone else is going to burn in hell forever. Who’s inconsiderate?

          • Trina Macko

            Hell fire and brimstone are the old style of preaching, when there was not much examination of Christian preaching… People have a right to believe what they believe, and you are right, to impose that on others is terrible when done against their will… ALL people have the right to loving relationships, legal equity and rights the same as others and the same as with married couples, and to be treated with dignity. I may or may not believe in their life style, but it is not up to me to punish them if they don’t live as I think is correct if I am not being damaged directly by their behavior and take away human rights they deserve. I may have a personal opinion or belief about things such as these, but am sure not going to beat up on others because of my beliefs, and to not do so is really because of God… I believe he would not like me to do that… not if we are to love others as we love ourselves. We may confront directly in one to one conversation and express opinion, but we are instructed to do this kindly; to ream somebody out is pretty nasty… I don’t know one example where Jesus raged at any one but the money lenders in the Temple.. and he did that because he was very angry they were taking advantage of the worshippers who came there to worship and the lenders were in effect stealing from the citizens, AND in a place that was supposed to be holy and filled with the love of God.. he hated their hypocrisy and stood up for those who could not stand up for themselves. It’s important to stand up for others when they cannot help themselves and suffer.

          • Tess Dommer

            Look the whole gay marriage thing is all about getting rid of the Holy Sacrament of Marriage all together. No one cares that two men or two women want to be together. What we don’t want is for a handful of people to demand that the definition of Marriage which is between ONE MAN & ONE WOMAN be changed. You see you and others like you don’t have the right to make decisions for everyone else. God Created MAN and realized that MAN needed a suitable mate so HE created WOMAN to be with man. You see two homosexuals cannot PRO~CREATE therefore the Holy Sacrament of Marriage does NOT apply. You say that those of us who embrace GOD should keep it to ourselves while you give yourself the right to shout to the world that you’re homosexual. Got Hypocrisy. You see as a Christian and an American I can pray wherever I want when I want and spread the WORD as CHRIST instructed us to do without fear of being persecuted or attacked and demoralized by you who are the minority. The first amendment protects us.

          • Robert Jory

            Bigotry much? Ok let’s start off with marriage was not created by god or Christianity. It was practiced long before Christianity even began. “You see you and others like you don’t have the right to make decisions for everyone else.” Try taking your own advice. You don’t get to decide if two people can marry or not just because you’re a bigot. God is not real so I don’t really care what you say god says. The only time the bible says not to have men sleep with men is in Leviticus, which also says not to eat pigs, don’t get tattoos and a bunch of other things I’m sure your hypocritical ass does every day. Two homosexual can procreate, it’s called science. Skin cells can be taken from both men or both women and used to create sex cells which are then combined to create a fertilized egg. As for homosexuals or atheists being a minority doesn’t mean you can take our constitutional rights away. I’m not surprised at the rage and hate coming from a Christian. You are continuing where the Crusades and Inquisition left off. Well done, satan worshiper.

          • Tess Dommer

            LOL when you cannot defend your ignorance throw out the word BIGOT which you are the epitome of. Its apparent that you know not the definition. And it is you who are taking our constitutional rights away. You don’t understand the first amendment child. And no two people of the same sex cannot procreate. You need a male and female. Science has nothing to do with it. As for hate? Its you who hates and demoralizes and insults Christians. But you’re to dumb to figure that out. You are not only a bigot but a fascist. Oh and I don’t care if two homo’s hitch up via civil unions. What you need to understand that MARRIAGE = One Man & One Woman. Deal with it.

          • Robert Jory

            I’m done arguing with an idiot. Keep knocking down the chess pieces and shitting on the board, pigeon.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            Thank you, Robert…just what I was thinking…lol

          • rabbers

            Tess – you are clearly severley brainwashed, a little mad – and also quite rude. Also using captial letters is considered shouting. Please stop shouting.

            If your God is so all powerful, why did he let atheists like me exist in the first place? Delusional – you should seek help.

          • Tess Dommer

            By the way can you give me the names or groups that have told you that you would burn in hell? Or is it that you are thinking it may be a possibility. Personally I don’t think you will go to hell but I do know that until you embrace GOD you will never have peace in your life and your life will be meaningless. Give HIM a chance. Many people of your mindset have seen the light and are joyous in the Lord. You can CHOOSE that for yourself or you can keep doing what you’re doing hoping for a different outcome. FREE CHOICE. Take it or leave it.

          • Robert Jory

            I’d rather think for myself then have a bronze age barbaric society do it for me. The Bible is BS and needs to be in the fiction section with all the other supernatural mythology. Offering salvation or eternal damnation in hellfire is not free choice, it’s an ultimatum. Learn the difference.

          • Tess Dommer

            You don’t think for yourself. You regurgitate what you have been told. If you truly believe that the “BIBLE” is bull**** than don’t read it and don’t discuss it but don’t be insulting to the majority who do read the good book. In order for you to demand that “BIBLE” be put into the Fiction Section would strongly suggest that YOU think of yourself as a GOD and who believes it is your right to make decisions for everyone else. You are full of yourself. The real problem is that YOU cannot stand that their is something out there far more superior and bigger than you are. Over time you will SEEK HIM. We all do. Good Luck and Merry Christmas.

          • Robert Jory

            You are awfully full of yourself to assume to know me. If you want to hear regurgitation just listen to any Christian. The Bible is bullshit, same as the Talmud and the Koran and Greek Mythology. It is literature though. I have probably read more of the Bible than most Christians because I don’t only look at the happy, peaceful parts. Learning what you fanatics are worshiping is part of knowing how to end your zealotry. I don’t have to think of myself as a god to know something is fake. I know Scientology is bullshit but I don’t have to pretend to be god to do that. Are you truly this insane or just childish? I completely understand there is something greater than me, it’s called nature. Science shows us the awesome power of nature and the beautiful or destructive things it can do. Has nothing to do with your imaginary friend. I will seek out truth which means anything but religion.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            “Wow, you want to have it both ways?”

            It isn’t the people here that want it both ways….it is in the Bible. The contradictions in the Bible number in the thousands.

          • Tess Dommer

            1. You don’t have to read the BIBLE
            2. You don’t have to Pray.
            3. You don’t have to attend any “CHURCH”.
            4. You don’t have to celebrate Christmas or Easter or any other HOLIDAY ~ HOLY DAY.
            5. You don’t have to sing Christmas Songs.
            6 You don’t have to decorate a Christmas Tree
            7. You don’t have to put up Christmas Lights.
            8. You don’t have to look at any Nativity Scene in public or in the private yards of your fellow man.
            9. You don’t have to exchange Christmas Gifts.
            10. You don’t have to attend Christmas Parades.
            11. You don’t have to do anything that you don’t want to do.
            But****
            You don’t have the RIGHT to demoralize Christians or attack Christmas or demand that the Bible be banned, Christmas Trees to be addressed as Holiday Trees. You don’t have to the right to demand that Nativity Scenes be taken down in public (We Pay Taxes as well).. You don’t have the right to demand that children in schools be denied the right to sing Silent Night, Away in a Manager or Joy to the World. You see in America we have FREEDOM of RELIGION not FREEDOM from…. Our founders were men of faith and clearly stated in our First Amendment that we have freedom of speech. They were also clear that their would not be ONE established religion as was the case in England with the Church of England. Their is NO SEPARATION of CHURCH and STATE. Those words appear NO WHERE in our CONSTITUTION. The fact is the first amendment means that the GOVERNMENT was to stay out of RELIGION but RELIGION was NOT to be taken OUT of GOVERNMENT. You may want to do some homework on our Founders and lean that America was founded on Judiac Christian Principles. You need to learn HOW to THINK vs being TOLD what to THINK. Good Luck.

          • JudgeX X

            Freedom of Speech does in fact allow me to ask for Bibles to be banned and to demoralize people who seek to demoralize me.

            Do you realize what it feels like to be told you are going to burn in Hell forever and ever? Let’s think about the term “demoralizing” for a minute.

            I’ve been told countless times by Christians, directly and indirectly, that ALL of my efforts on the Earth are meaningless, that NOTHING that I do matters, and that EVERYONE that I care about … are all for nothing because we’re all going to burn in Hell no matter what we do, unless we believe in one specific fable about a really good con artist 2000 years ago.

            So before you go all RANDOM CAPS in a gigantic tirade because someone hurt your Christian feelings by telling you that the bible is BS, maybe you should consider what Christians tell people every single day by the thousands.

            Don’t dish it out if you can’t take it… and now it’s too late… by 2030, calling yourself a “Christian” will evoke audible laughter from any populated room in this country.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            My Favorite Quote by George Carlin.

            “Think about it. Religion has actually convinced people that there’s an invisible man living in the sky who watches everything you do, every minute of every day. And the invisible man has a special list of ten things he does not want you to do. And if you do any of these ten things, he has a special place, full of fire and smoke and burning and torture and anguish, where he will send you to live and suffer and burn and choke and scream and cry forever and ever ’til the end of time! .. ………………………………………………………………………………………………
            But He loves you.”

          • Tess Dommer

            WOW not even I believe that you’re the ignorant. Look if you don’t believe in GOD then stop talking about HIM. Its clear that you need an education.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            I had a 55 year education in the Christian religion…so don’t even go there, Tess. At 60, I began a deep study of my religion. My Pastor used to tell the whole congregation that there should be more people like Beverly in their study of their religion and the Bible…the only problem was it led me to so many more questions that I couldn’t find the answer or make sense of the contradictions in the Bible. I didn’t just wake up one day and say I was going to be an Atheist. I took me almost 4 years of my deep study before I could even say, I don’t think I believe all this. Another 3 years before I could call myself an Agnostic….and 2 years to say I was an Atheist . I am now 3 years an Atheist. So I know what kind of fear goes with reading things I thought for sure would send me to hell.
            So, don’t judge someone without knowing ANYTHING about them at all. Besides, it goes totally against your Bible teachings.

          • Dorisa

            C.S. Lewis was once an atheist until he found Christ to be the way, the truth, and the life. I encourage all of you to read his highly philosophical book entitled Mere Christianity. I hope you all will find hope and peace in Christ Jesus! Love, Dorisa

          • Beverly Vokoun

            I am glad he found what gave him peace. I wish you a very Merry Christmas. My family will be celebrating The Winter Solstice tomorrow :O)

          • rargos

            Amazing – your view of God is based on George Carlin. I think he’s a great comedian, but forming your opinion of God based on a comedy sketch is the most un-intellectual thing I can think of

          • Beverly Vokoun

            And you’re an idiot…I said it was a funny quote, not my basis for my beliefs.
            It amazes me how people can read something and make up their own mind what the person was actually saying.

          • Beverly Vokoun

            Isn’t that sad, that we will be laughing at Christians instead of trying to educate them. Nobody should laugh at anyone who has been brainwashed against their will….

          • Beverly Vokoun

            Well, I have done my “homework” on our founding fathers and they were NOT Judiac Christians….most of them were. Deists. (http://freethought.mbdojo.com/foundingfathers.html)
            And this pretty much says (non-Christian) and there should be separation of church and state.
            Although the Declaration of Independence mentioned “Nature’s God” and the “Creator,” the Constitution made no reference to a divine being, Christian or otherwise, and the First Amendment explicitly forbid the establishment of any official church or creed. If there is a clear legacy bequeathed by the founders, it is the insistence that religion was a private matter in which the state should not interfere.
            (Britannica.com)

          • Tonya

            I am a believer and I am not angry, aggressive, or mad. I know what I believe and know what’s real, but you and your organization have declared War on those who believe in GOD and JESUS CHRIST, you are the ones who seem angry. I feel sorry for you because with your words and your mouth “you have sealed your fate”. Remember when GOD shows you who HE is don’t say HIS name.

          • Robert Jory

            As Ricky Gervais says: “Being told you’re going to hell by a Christian is about as scary as a child telling you Santa isn’t bringing you gifts.” I don’t fear your imaginary friend.

          • NorwegianThunder

            yes – about ideas

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Too bad.
            If they’re insulted for believing in nonsense then who are we to deny them?
            Sometimes the truth is insulting.
            Like that time I was certain to win the lottery. Damn insulting that some others won. That’s, to quote myself from above, “Too bad.”

          • mary

            All human beings at every stage of life deserve dignity–that is the message of Christ. Don’t shoot the messenger that you agree with.
            The Roman Empire were the atheists and look at their horrific slaughter of innocent people.

          • NorwegianThunder

            See my reply above

            Re: Roman Empire. You’re wrong on both counts. Re atheism and if they were you need to prove their actions were motivated by not believing in something that doesn’t exist.

            I’m a Lokki atheist. I’m not guided by that non belief.

            Peace and morals are not the message of any religious text.

          • yosemitedave

            Idiot. People are their ideas. Your very identity is a set of your ideas of yourself. If you attack someone’s inner belief, you are in effect attacking that person’s very being.

          • NorwegianThunder

            For your consideration…

            People are people. Ideas are ideas.

            My humanity – my being human is an immutable property regardless of the views I hold … As are yours

            Your attack with the word “idiot” doesn’t offend me in any way because I know that it is directed at my idea. If ideas are immune to critical review and discussion then the progress of our society halts. I welcome critical discussion of ideas.

            I think it’s a different problem going on in Western countries – It’s contemporary academic leftists piggybacking and perverting classical liberalism creating bizarre new thoughts and standards arguing from the point of view of epistemic relativism and taking an old classical argument that because of relativism “we cannot make judgments about cultural practices” and morphing it to “we should not make judgments about cultural practices”

            This then gets extended into Multiculturalism. The fundamental idea about multiculturalism is that different cultures can and ought to co-exist peacefully…

            Today it has morphed into something completely different and this concept eternally confounds the leftist academics – but here goes.

            A criticism of a process or a criticism of a cultural practice or a criticism of a religious text is not the same as the criticism of a person. Nor is it the same as the criticism of a race of people. Multiculturalism contributed to this confusion by extending immutable properties of people like race, gender, sexual orientation to all epistemic systems, cultural ways of knowing, faith, traditions, mythologies, religions etc.

            The biggest problem coming out of this is the belief, is the value that ideas have dignity. When you believe that dignity is a property of an idea and not just a property of people then criticizing an idea becomes akin to criticizing the person.

            Granting ideas dignity has two profound problems.

            1. Criticizing faith traditions becomes viewed as hate speech.
            2. The radicalization of an individual based on their criticisms. This is done by attaching the “-ophobia” to someone who criticizes. For example I’m critical of Christmas and become a Christmas-o-phobic (note the parallel – islamophobe, homophobe, faithohphobe.

            This becomes the end of allowable opposing views and leads to a fundamentalist style of conflict.

          • Anon

            Religion is a part of who you are if you’re religious, so the “people =! ideas” distinction doesn’t really work.

          • NorwegianThunder

            Religion is something you choose to believe in. Just like any other proposition – evidenced or otherwise.

          • Rob_Drury

            Absolutely correct! Religion is belief and tradition. Christianity is experience and empirical knowledge.

        • Robert Jory

          I give respect to people who deserve it. Respect isn’t something everyone gets no matter what. That’s kind of the point in earning someone’s respect. Teaching children that they are born sinners and will go to a burning hell for eternity unless they love their parents imaginary friend is child abuse. That doesn’t earn my respect. I have no respect for a cult of human sacrifice that glorifies the death of one person for the benefit of others. That’s what being a Christian is. Praising the death and torture of Jesus so everyone is saved. That is disgusting and in no way deserves respect any more than Scientology or Mormonism or Islam does. This group is trying to show people the truth. The truth is Christmas has nothing to do with Jesus. All the traditions of Christmas came from pagan beliefs long before the events of the bible. These traditions come from ancient Celtic, Roman and Egyptian beliefs and have nothing at all to do with the Christian Jesus. Look up Saturnalia. Disagree with the atheist organizations all you want, they will continue to show the truth about ridiculous cults.

          • Matt

            I actually agree with most of what you are saying, Jory. I too feel that religion is a cancer. It’s just that this specific billboard is starting that conversation poorly. People you’ve never even met DO deserve respect. Even if thier religion is a cancer the people themselves do not deserve to be insulted this way. I know that Christians co-opted the pagan traditions a long time ago, but so what? Let them have it and you can call your holiday something else. This idea that Christmas is a tradition for everyone is stupid. You can still go be with family and celebrate however you like, but if you are not a christian leave Christmas alone. Call your holiday Festivus! If the intention is to start a discussion with the public at large (which is the audience of a billboard) it should be done with more tact and consideration than what this billboard displays. Again people you’ve never met before DO deserve respect regardless of your feelings toward thier religion.

          • Robert Jory

            Christians as a whole will not receive respect from me. They have already proven they lack judgment based on their belief in supernatural nonsense. To me that is reason enough not to respect them. I may respect some other choices they make like helping others but that’s as far as it will go. They believe in an evil concept and call it righteous. You are asking me to respect them like I would respect a child abuser or a rapist. They will get no such respect from me. This billboard gets the idea of not believing in god or Jesus to the public where they might not normally be exposed to it. That’s a success in my book. If you don’t like it you can cry in a corner. Being offended by something is nothing more than whining.

          • George

            Gotta love an atheist that knows everything. To know that Christianity is false, one would have to be all knowing. I highly doubt that you do, so instead, I’ll conclude that you’re just arrogant, full of your own opinion, and not really interested in reason.

            You may now continue with your vitriol… sorry for the interruption.

          • Robert Jory

            Let’s look at this with reason. The bible is the only reason for believing in Christianity since it is the only document still in circulation that teaches it. The bible was written generations after the people in the bible died. Their society was a bronze age culture of human and animal sacrifice, misogyny, slavery, and infanticide. There is no other record of Jesus than the bible. Depending on where a child is born and the religion of their parents determine the religion the child will grow up to believe. There are tens of thousands of religions but each claims they are the correct one. Many religions before Christianity had the same events such as a virgin birth on the winter solstice, martyr being sacrificed, martyr resurrection, and being able to heal the infirm. All prophets and miracles happened in a very small area in the Middle East. No miracles have happened or been recorded since the time of the bible. Evolution shows us humans evolved and were not made from dust and ribs. Science shows us snakes do not talk. Noah took the time to separate animals back to their original region such as all marsupials back to Australia.
            I may come off as arrogant and I’m sorry. That tends to happen when you’re right.

          • George

            Your ignorance is astounding! If you actually did your own research you would slap yourself for the lame example you rolled out. All the constantly repeated examples of similarity, location, culture, etc. prove nothing to the contrary. It only gives those that want a way out of facing the inevitable truth of a Creator.

            What we actually have are carefully documented records and eye witness accounts written at a time when anyone could have contended that what was written were lies, yet there are none. No books written about the great Christian conspiracy, or Jewish fairy tale. None. Zilch. No facts to the contrary.

            You realize that by the very book’s writings, you are fooled, no? If God’s Holy Spirit were in you to guide you to the truth, you would know it. No fairy tale, no myth, no confusion. God’s word alive in you and you would know it.

            That has always been God’s offer. Once the light is turned on, you stop fumbling for the switch. By the way, you do know that there are 60 million Christians in communist atheist China, no?

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Which god?

          • Mark

            Resisting
            Fleshly Appetites

            Ephesians
            2:1-7

            The Holy Spirit guides believers to make
            wise and righteous decisions. But when Christians fail to listen, they can make
            choices that appeal to the flesh instead.

            After the serpent spoke to Eve, she no
            doubt took a long look at the tree of the knowledge of good and evil (Gen. 2:17;
            3:3). Whatever she might have thought about the tree before, she now saw it with
            new eyes—flesh-focused eyes. Genesis 3 tells us that the forbidden tree appealed
            to Eve in three ways: 1) it was good for food, 2) it was a delight to the eyes,
            and 3) it was desirable to make one wise.

            In other words, the tree could fulfill
            three legitimate human appetites: the desire for tasty meals, beauty, and
            wisdom. There is nothing wrong with these God-given yearnings. The Lord created
            a variety of food and an earth packed with breathtaking sights so that people
            could enjoy them. He also offers the Holy Spirit as a source of His true wisdom
            and knowledge. In fact, it is the Spirit who teaches believers to keep fleshly
            appetites under control and in balance.

            Meanwhile, Satan works very hard at
            corrupting healthy desires. He abhors seeing people’s appetites satisfied. What
            he wants is to watch a person lusting after a good thing until he or she is
            controlled by the impulse to have it.

            The
            Devil is pleased when people make themselves slaves to a desire that—in the
            proper context—the Lord intended to be enjoyed freely. A believer walking in the
            Holy Spirit rejects gluttony, preferring desires that are within God’s
            boundaries instead. That’s how we get His very best.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Cripple fight!
            - South Park 5:2

          • berian

            thank you guest!!! that is an excellent exposition on that whole satan-eve-apple business and a lot more useful than the rest of this stuff. i’m a Christian who believes that Jesus was conceived around the solstice (Hanukkah) and born on the early autumn (Feast of Tabernacles.) from what i understand, when everyone was trying to decide when Christmas was going to be celebrated, nobody could agree when Jesus was born so they arbitarily decided to put Christmas to coincide with a lot of other holidays tradtionally celebrated around the winter solstice. since then a lot of sciptural and historical texts have been found and we have more peices of the puzzle as to when Jesus was actually born, but by then Christmas was pretty firmly established at it’s currently observed date. IF YOU THINK PEOPLE ARE MAD AT ATHEISTS, WATCH WHAT HAPPENS WHEN A CHRISTIAN QUESTIONS THE NATURE OF jESUS’ INVOLVEMENT WITH CHRISTMAS LOL!!!!!!

          • mary

            You throw out the words the bronze age as if it is meaningless. Have you any clue how incredible that time period was in human history? How incredible the Celts were?

          • Robert Jory

            They were primitive compared to us now yet many still follow their barbaric teachings.

          • mary

            Miracles happen every moment of every day.
            Snakes talk to you every day–don’t you recognize men with forked tongues yet? It is a fact that the earth had a great flood. Salt water lakes inland are part of this find.
            Evolution is a theory. It is not causation. Much of Darwin’s guesses were wrong. He also stole most of hios material from his grandfather. He studied bugs. He wasn’t an incredible genius. He made observations and some make absolutely no sense. Some may be reasonable, but as a general theory of progress of life–it’s been tossed long ago. All the evolutionary pictures of the horse evolving from a dog like size to larger and larger in my childhood science books have all been thrown out. Those animals were all different and not horses.
            So, to accept on blind faith evolution as a “reality” is not a good idea, eh?

          • Robert Jory

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW1Lpa23mOw

            No faith needed when it’s true.

          • mary

            Oh, please. This guy’s silly. He is no Christopher Hitchens. I loved Hitchens.

          • Robert Jory

            Hitchens was only a journalist, author and debater. Dawkins is a evolutionary biologist. He actually studies evolution for a living. Sure Hitchens was more entertaining in debates but Dawkins knows what he’s talking about.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Let’s start with the Null hypothesis: There are no gods.

            Now, your turn…

          • johnjohnson

            are you 100% sure? I’m not

          • NorwegianThunder

            I don’t think that anyone who claims a 100% position is being intellectually honest – on either side of the fence – it’s called holding a position dogmatically.

            As an atheist I say there’s insufficient evidence to warrant belief in a divine, supernatural creator of the universe. However, if I were shown sufficient evidence to warrant belief in such an entity, then I would believe. No faith required.

            This is a position the faithful cannot accommodate or occupy. If they were able to do so – they they wouldn’t have faith now – would they.

          • marahnatha

            I hope you don’t think anybody “needs” your respect. That’s what I don’t get about homosexuals. It’s not enough to live & let live, we must APPROVE their lifestyle. Nobody can be forced to believe anything, we choose what we believe and reject. Many Christians were once at least agnostic & have been where you are. You haven’t been where we are & have no concept of how we think.

          • Robert Jory

            Who says you have to approve of homosexuals? They just want to live in peace and have the right to marry who they love. Religious nutjobs try to take that basic right away from them. You don’t have to approve of interracial marriage to allow them to get married, same for homosexuals. As for no one being forced to believe anything, tell that to all the children raised in religious homes. Tell them they have a choice to not believe when their parents tell them they have to love their imaginary friend or burn in a pit of fire for eternity. They are forced in what they can believe until they are old enough to get away from their evil parents.
            Where have these Christians been that I haven’t? I was raised in a Christian home and believed it for a long time. Then I grew up and knew Santa was fake as well as God and Jesus. What concept is it you think I can’t grasp about how you think?

          • Rob_Drury

            Where have we been? In the presence of Almighty God. Robert, you were never a Christian. Living in a “Christian home” doesn’t make one a Christian, any more than being in a garage makes one a car. A Christian doesn’t “believe” in God; a Christian KNOWS God personally. There is no such thing as a former Christian.

          • Robert Jory

            You’re the scary kind of Christian. Don’t drown any babies even if the voices do sound like “god”.

          • luis

            I have to agree, living in a christian home does not automatically make all the occupants of that home christian. Salvation comes through knowing God through his Son our Savior Jesus Christ, not through Osmosis.

          • Cameron Durham

            That’s total bullshit, I’m sorry. Adhering to the Christian faith makes you a Christian. A former Christian is one who was a Christian, and now is not. Simple as that.

          • Rob_Drury

            Oh my goodness, Cameron; you’re so right! We are all different people with different perspectives, and our language gives us some latitude in defining terms according to how they relate to each of us. I personally happen to feel that God’s own definition of the term “Christian” is the most appropriate, so that’s the one I choose to use. Thanks so much for the correction.

          • luis

            A fish may love a bird, but where will they make their home?

          • Robert Jory

            Think you might have said the dumbest thing on this forum so far. Two homosexual men are not a fish and a bird. They are the same species and can live happily together. Christians hate homosexuals because of Leviticus but have you read all the other rules? No tattoos, no pork, no seafood if it’s not a fish, no working on Saturday. Christians do all the other things it says not to do but get their panties in a bunch when two men or two women love each other. Hypocrites.

          • Some Ideas Are Dumb

            Matt, would you also be offended by a similar message being posted against pedophilia? There are some people that believe in that – do they also deserve a gentle discussion that won’t offend them?

          • Julie

            You’re kidding…..

          • Cameron Durham

            It’s weird: he kind of has a point, but at the same time, “You’re kidding…..” totally sums up the proper reaction.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            “You’re kidding” was pretty much my entire reaction to religion. So, partial credit.

          • marahnatha

            Everyone deserves basic human respect, I’m not talking about the kind of respect Jonas Salk should have for the polio virus or Cal Ripken for his continuous playing, but basic respect for who we are as human beings. You can’t say Mother Teresa didn’t do some good and she was motivated by winning the lost. How many hospitals have been built by atheism? How many atheists have helped poor people pay their utility bills and rent and provide food from their soup kitchens and food banks like the Salvation Army or many other Churches? In fact, an atheist group stopped a Church from giving out toys to the needy for Christmas. Those kids will remember that & going back to school without a coat, boots or other necessities Churches always give. Women’s groups knit blankets and make quilts to pass out to shelters and homeless people. It was interesting to me when a woman declared herself an atheist & some Atheist group bragged about sending her money because she spoke up & said she was an atheist. Well Christian groups don’t have a litmus test for who they help. They help whoever they can that has a need. I thnk you guys lost out on that one, too.

          • NorwegianThunder

            You don’t need to believe in a divine creator of the universe to do good things – if you do – well then there are other bigger problems present that could be addressed by therapy perhaps.

            People deserve respect – ideas don’t.

          • Trina Macko

            To us, Jesus IS a person… but you can’t see that… to you he is just an idea you can put down or treat carelessly… He existed, we love him as a person, we respect his memory… If someone put down your dead mother, would you not object? You would probably say it’s highly inconsiderate and mean to do that… well, we feel hurt just the same… respect and see Jesus as a person, and a member of our families, see it from our perspective and be kind.. because it is not kind to do what you have done… you are putting all Christians down as people FOR their beliefs… there is no excuse in ‘people deserve respect, ideas don’t’ WE are people, we want to be respected, Jesus is a person… If you preach a doctrine of love and really mean it, walk the walk, not just talk the talk.

          • NorwegianThunder

            Just because it’s real for you doesn’t make it actually real. The world is as the world is – independent of your belief system.

            My mother, who existed and for which I have verifiable repeatable independent empirical evidence, is dead. If someone decided to put her down (as you put it) my first inclination would actually be to want to know why they held that opinion. It wouldn’t hurt me or offend me or alter the memories I have of her.

            If this person had no objective stance to their opinion then my memory of my mother is unchanged and my assessment of how that person makes decisions in enhanced.

            If they had an objective stance – then I’d have to weigh the credibility of their evidence before accepting it.

            This historical jesus, if he actually existed in the first place – well chances are he was just some guy.

            But was he the result of a woman being artificially inseminated by an entity with himself who caused himself to be born – brought to earth to be punished for something that had to do with a mystical garden and a talking snake. No I don’t think so.

            The evidence does not support the existence of a god in the first place. Everything after that point is moot.

            Do you respect Lokki or Thor or Zeus?

          • mary

            Wow. Where to begin? Young man, you’ve been deceived, big time.

            1.) Hell exists. One chooses to go there in every moment of every day consciously. Read the Gospels–not someone’s opinion, but the actual Gospels. John is the beloved, Luke’s Gospel is Mary’s story, Mark’s records Peter’s preaching and Matthew was Levi–a tax collector. Mark, Matthew and John all knew Christ. Luke was a physician who became a disciple, he was not an apostle. He records the words and life of the Blessed Mother.

            2.) God is not imaginary. He is reality. Read the story of Our Lady of Guadolupe. Read the Miracle of the Host in Argentina and Archbishop Bergoglio.

            3.) watch the movie with Robert DiNiro–The Mission. See if you can figure out forgiveness and redemption of the spirit of a man.

            4.) Christmas has everything to do with Christ. The word means Christ’s Mass. Christ’s birth changed the world forever. You are clueless as to th change He brought. Look for the answer.

            5.) Pagan traditions. Let me explain something very simple to you. How it is that people are converted. The law of God is written on every human heart and soul. It is your conscience. When someone tells you the truth, you recognize it because it is something you always knew deep down in your very soul–even if society says its not true. Society is nearly always wrong. Not religion–society and its funky, moronic rules and fads.

            Getting to know a people, a culture and a tradition and sharing yours with them does not mean you reject what they hold dear but absorb and embrace it and appreciate its value and continue it as part of our very beautiful differences in culture.

            That’s why we have the tree, trick or treating on All Hallow’s eve, the eve of All Saint’s Day, The Mass is the last Supper–which is the Passover Seder dinner.

            Pass over has been a tradition since it happened–the angel of death passed over the house of slaves held in captivity by Egypt and were beaten to death daily until Pharoh’s adopted son, Moses, a prophet, set them free.

            6.) I’m a Celt. Don’t tell me about Celtic beliefs and nonsense that people have invented about the Celts. The Druidic priests were the most revered wise men in the ancient world. They were present at the library of Alexandria. They read Moses. The Pentateuch is the Greek translation of the torah read by . . .

            Solomon, Socrates and Aristotle

            In Earliest Biblical Painting, Greek Philosophers Admire King’s Wisdom

            Theodore Feder • 10/02/2012

            Pleading for her baby’s life, a woman kneels at the feet of King Solomon in 1 Kings 3:16–28. This Roman wall painting from Pompeii is the earliest known depiction of a Biblical scene. Who commissioned this painting: a Jew, a Christian or a gentile? Photo courtesy Scala/Art Resource, NY

            Is it possible that the earliest existing picture of a scene from the Bible also includes the philosophers Socrates and Aristotle as onlookers? It is not only possible; I believe that is the case.

            The earliest depiction of a Biblical scene comes from a site that is perhaps better known to some for its erotic art than for its religious devotions: Pompeii. The city was buried in volcanic ash in 79 A.D. following the eruption of nearby Mt. Vesuvius. It was a devastating tragedy for Pompeii’s residents but a boon to modern scholars and art historians.

            In the building known as the House of the Physician, excavators found a wall painting clearly depicting King Solomon seated on a raised tribunal and flanked by two counselors. As described in the Bible, two women have come to the Israelite monarch, each claiming to be the mother of the same infant. When Solomon orders the baby to be divided in half, the real mother, shown at the foot of the dais, pleads with him to spare the child and announces her willingness to relinquish her claim. The other woman is shown standing by the butcher block on which the infant has been placed. As a soldier raises an axe to do the king’s bidding, she seizes what she believes will be her portion, saying, according to the Biblical text, “Let it be neither mine, nor thine, but divide it.” It is obvious who the real mother is. The child is given to her unharmed as soldiers and observers look on, marveling at Solomon’s wisdom (1 Kings 3:16–28).

            It’s all very fascinating. You need to start working on your knowledge base.

          • Robert Jory

            You are in the category of ‘too far gone’. Don’t bother responding, I don’t argue with crazy. Live in your imaginary world in peace.

          • Trina Macko

            “Praising the death and torture of Jesus so everyone is saved”, your statement… wow… Jesus gave up his life willingly, it was not taken from him.. he gave it up so others would see he did it out of compassion, to be an example and show how much someone (He) cared about humankind that he could not bear their suffering, and would die as a martyr to show them how important they were, and are… and in doing so, that he had compassion for their nasty ways that were harming themselves, that he wanted to get their attention so they would listen and think of a better way to live… he died because seeing their pain made him feel so hurt, so sad, that death was the only way for him… there are other theological interpretations, but nobody made him a cult of human sacrifice.. HE chose the sacrifice… we don’t benefit from his DEATH, we benefit from the lesson of his life and the sacrifice, not the torture and the state of death… you seem to be missing a lot here, and just glossing over the surface… think more deeply.. Praising his death and suffering saves nobody… it’s learning to live with his values and beliefs that ‘saves’ people from lives of desperation and degradation… they live more lovingly, more humanely, and in that way are ‘saved’ if only on this earth… and because they believe in God, as they do so, we believe he counts us as one of his own to be in relationship with him.. No idea what Christians taught you before, but it doesn’t sound very kind and mostly lip service… I can tell you WANT to believe in God… I believe some day you will… I think people have taught you or you have heard some really wrong things about him, no wonder you don’t believe… The biggest thing is to believe the love.. for me my conversion came when I heard that Jesus loves us, and I believed it… there is too little love in this life. If everyone who is a believer remembers that he stated the two greatest commandments are to love your God with all your heart and soul and to love your neighbor as yourself, all the rest is a piece of cake.. all flows from that.. the rest of the ‘words’ don’t matter.. If you love God (Jesus in my case, and love means trying to be as he preached in life and behavior) and your neighbor, all the rest of your life will work out… it’s not easy, but it does… Merry Christmas to you… to me having the word CHRIST in Christmas is as it should be… it’s a good time to remember what he wants and wanted for us in terms of life and what his idea of success is… whatever day it is, it’s good to do that, and if people want to do that on Christmas, why do you object? I still don’t get it. All that people want to really do is preach love, if they are real Christians.. why are you so against that?

          • Robert Jory

            If this is all true and he died for us so we are cleared of sin then I don’t need to go to church and be forgiven. It’s all done because of human sacrifice. No need to worship.
            Now let’s say this isn’t true. You’re glorifying human sacrifice. One person’s death for the betterment of others. Some Muslims believe they can be a martyr for the betterment of their people, too. Guess what? It also requires human sacrifice. Religion is disgusting, barbaric and very harmful to children and the people who believe it. If Jesus was even a real person he was only a really nice hippy preaching peace to everyone. Nothing more.

          • Trina Macko

            Well, if he was only a hippy preaching, his preaching and content seem to be pretty good from my point of view.. but witnesses say he rose from the dead, and that he rose up into the heavens (sky) to be with his father… so by virtue of that rising from the dead and ascension it puts him beyond the realm of just a nice hippy… but that is up to you to believe or not believe.. But I don’t think you have heard of Christians strapping bombs on their chests and killing OTHERS while they sacrifice themselves… Radicals are radicals, but the killing of innocents is never correct, is it? But if you were in a roadway, and I ran out to save you, and in the act lost my life but you lived, wouldn’t that sacrifice of my life be one you would have be grateful for, and maybe your family and society be grateful for depending on your place in society? So even if someone does not believe in God, as you don’t, if you sacrificed your life for me, it would be no less worthy a sacrifice, and definitely praiseworthy… Beating yourself with a whip and wearing a hair shirt just to bear the discomfort, or giving up your life for no reason is definitely ridiculous and disgusting, I agree… But if someone takes a bullet for someone else so they can survive, is that to be despised? I mean, I don’t like the idea of anyone THROWING away their life for no reason just to throw it away.. but if you do it for a reason of love, like to save your kid, that makes sense to me; we don’t want our child to die, it’s more painful to think of them dead than our harm, so we jump in the way of the car and hope it all sorts itself out… Actually, when you get down to it, I guess you could say Jesus did this in a way… though theologians would argue about the technical points and say I’m oversimplifying.. but he did sacrifice in the hope of saving us a lot of pain in living life badly… the world has been a bit better since he did that and more civilized as his teachings spread after his death… things were achieved, stating it modestly. What is the better part of human behavior, not to give and let others suffer as long as we are fine? Live a life of selfish righteousness? Many of us don’t get the opportunity to be a ‘hero’ and sacrifice our lives, sane people don’t look for ways to throw their lives away… but if we are living right, daily we make little generousities in the good of others that involve some sacrifice.. if we didn’t, we’d be like lions in the field not sharing their food and snarling at others who are also hungry… don’t want to degrade to THAT level.

          • Robert Jory

            I would agree with some parts of your comment. As a person who works in a school I would willing take a bullet for any of the children I work with if someone came to cause them harm. But that would be dying for a purpose. The death of Jesus did nothing but start a church that has since killed millions and indoctrinates children and in many instances molests them as well. Jesus died for nothing. The bible says he died for our sins so we could be forgiven the mistake made by Adam and Eve. Why must someone die for god to forgive us? Is he not powerful enough to just wipe the slate clean? Is he not humble enough to simple say “you are forgiven”? No, he has to cause more bloodshed and pain. All for a silly original sin that he caused by putting two children in a garden and telling them what not to do then hiding to watch them do it anyway. Not to mention a ‘talking snake’ to tempt them. I’d call him a terrible parent at best and a tyrant at worst. But to believe all of this is just delusion. The bible should be a historical document kept for it’s literary value only. Nothing in it should be accepted as truth or factual.

          • Trina Macko

            I don’t know about why someone must die for God to forgive us… I think it was as an example to show to what lengths God would go to tell us how much we are valued, to sacrifice the very thing that meant the most to him, who was in his human form his son so we would know the earnestness of his intentions. People are flawed, they were flawed when Jesus died, and to show us how much he grieved over their sinfulness he gave up his life saying ‘really guys, cut this out, it grieves me so’… I have felt so grieved by things in life sometimes and the dastardly quality of people’s behavior I have at times almost been wanting to make a large statement to have the world wise up.. but there is nothing I can do in my little way… but I fully understand the feeling. People can be really despicable at times, and it can be very disheartening… overwhelming. I see all of this in a very much more pragmatic and in simpler terms and language than that of the church and how they teach it with their buzz words like ‘original sin’… what the heck is that, anyhow? I just believe left on our own and raised without teaching and raised by wolves we’d become wolves (then again some wolves might be nicer than some people), but what I believe is that we are inclined to be kind of greedy by nature, and being taught to forestall our own pleasures and have the maturity to wait for fulfillment of needs or abrogation of needs for the greater good sort of needs to be taught… by example if nothing else or people would be savages.. everyone needs some code to make sense of their lives and an idea of some morality… or chaos results… And I don’t really believe in the ‘talking snake’, interesting as a metaphor, but not a literal sense. Again, though the snake is Old Testament… I can’t find where Jesus says he did not come to remove the law (of Moses) but to enlarge understanding of it, I can’t remember the exact words, but it’s there… He called it the law of Moses, but by the time he came people had gotten pretty corrupted and non loving, so he came to make them re evaluate.. Those who were wise Jews heard the sense of what he said, those who had no ability to see his wisdom didn’t… The Pharisees weren’t too happy that they saw the sense of his words, they would lose supporters if they did, so they fought it.. politics… Well, it’s all interesting, anyhow…But I learn ideas from the Old Testament, personally, but live the example of the New Testament… that’s just me… seems bad not to be able to do the most loving thing when it seems the most sensible to me, but the Pharisees didn’t see it that way, they were too bound up in the ‘rules’ and their own power… nothing new in that, and human beings being obtuse and stubborn and not be able to admit their own agenda. Jesus thought the way they interpreted God was false, and told them that… they were so threatened they had him killed.. Nice guys, huh?

          • Trina Macko

            Please, also, don’t take my comment above of ‘wise Jews’ mean that I condemn Jews cause they don’t believe in Jesus… I misspoke… just at that time I think he had a lot to say, and the Pharisees were very threatened and didn’t see what was in front of their faces… I actually like Jews and have tremendous respect for them.. Jesus was a Jew and Jews are nice people, moral people and good people.. they may not believe I what I believe.. but the Old Testament and Torah is the base for Christianity, so where would even we be without them? So who would I or we be to hate them? And no, Jews are not responsible for the death of Jesus and all to be condemned, that’s ridiculous if anyone would say so. His death was a political thing in a way… they were worried his presence in the area would cause turmoil during a holiday time in the city, and put him to death to prevent any dissent that might arise… typical humans… Pontius Pilot had his part so Rome would not criticize him.

          • Robert Jory

            It seems we are both set in our ways. As information becomes easier and easier to access less and less will believe in religion. I’ll leave you with this little video. This is how I see the teachings of Christianity.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJrqLV4yeiw

          • Trina Macko

            I haven’t watched the video yet, but will right after this… you have every right to have your individual beliefs and I respect that… you are loveable as you are, and ou know that also… wishing you well…

          • Trina Macko

            Sorry, Robert… I cried a bit as I looked at it… such bitterness… and there are definite lies and falsehoods in that video… we did not kill Jesus… we do not have to make reparations for that for the rest of our lives.. we are not being punished.. You forgot what I said… love god with all your heart and soul, and love your neighbor as yourself… the film forgets the love, and only concentrates on hate and emphasizes that, which is not what Christianity is about at all… how very sad. There is no joy in the depiction in this film, and that is extremely sad. But there is still hope, in people like me and my kind… it is not about money, it is not about being good enough, it’s about love, and all else follows from there… try to remember that I said that, ok? Organized religion may have misinterpreted and corrupted his message, but people are fallible, they inevitably mess up, but that does not mean there is NOBODY who believes as he intended it… Love your god with all your heart and soul, and love your neighbor as yourself… you don’t need a church to do or be that… just conviction and heart. As I have respected you, please respect me, love your neighbor as yourself.

        • marahnatha

          Thank you, Matt. I respect you very much.

        • johnjohnson

          This billboard just proves a point. You can’t cross out Jesus no matter how hard you try – even with a huge billboard. Jesus is the reason for the season and absolutely nothing can change that. If you prefer not to believe, then celebrate it as a season of presents and giving or whatever you want to make it. You do not have demean someone in order to make yourself known.

        • diogeneskarma

          Matt, while I respect your feelings, I feel I must remind you that this is not a holiday that celebrates Jesus. Scholars agree that Jesus was not born at this time and the Christians appropriated the holiday that celebrates the solstice in order to indoctrinate people just as they have other holidays. Atheists are simply reminding people of this fact. I am deeply offended daily by the Christian pro-life billboards dotting my town, but I would never even think of trying to silence these people. They have a right to speak and so do we.

      • Julie

        This site does have an agenda. The want to make sure government and church are separate. However, I enjoy Christmas carols and Christmas displays even though I am a non-believer. I do not like it when I hear school districts not allowing winter concerts with Christmas music. I must concede that we are not the majority and the majority has a right to happiness just as much as I do.

      • maranatha

        It’s not ourselves we worry about. Our eternity is secure. It’s for the lost ones that Jesus came for that we stand up and refuse to let a lie be told against our faith. Millions have died for this cause, the first generation having actually walked with Jesus & saw him face to face. Do you think they would lay down their lives knowing it was all fake? If atheists don’t have an agenda, why aren’t you on Madison Avenue during Islamic prayer? Why don’t you put up anti Hindu or anti Islamic billboards? There’s a least one RULE. If it might cost you something, you can be counted to not say anything negative like “Ramadan is better without Mohammad.”

        • Robert Jory

          You say it must be true because they gave their lives and wouldn’t do that knowing it’s fake. Does that mean Islam is true since suicide bombers lay down their lives for their faith? No, it just means you’re both wrong and dumb for dying for an imaginary figure. You follow the teachings of a bronze age society. Those that walked with Jesus walked with a charlatan that taught people to be nice but thought way too highly of himself. He was a delusional hippy if he even existed at all.
          Atheists don’t only refute Christianity but it’s funny that Christians cry foul when they don’t see anything being said about Islam or Judaism. All religion is wrong but since majority of the US is Christian most of the criticism will be against Christianity. But don’t worry Christians you’re not the only delusional people. You also make it very easy what with talking snakes, Noah’s Ark, 10k year old world. Nearly half the US thinks evolution is wrong when there is a clear consensus with scientists in that field that evolution is 100% fact. There are mountains of evidence to prove it and it would only take one fossil dated in the wrong period to prove it all wrong but there hasn’t been any.
          Religion is a cancer and one day it will be cured. People will open their eyes and see that the Bible, Torah and Quran all belong in mythology with Roman and Greek gods. Atheism is the fastest growing demographic.

          • Mark

            You are a sick man! When you die, I want you to look up and ask for relief of the suffering you will have for eternity. There will be none for you.

          • Robert Jory

            Someone’s upset. I know, finding out you’re whole life has been a lie can do that. No reason to call me sick. If anything religious people are sick, mentally. When I die I won’t suffer or even know I’m dead because… I’ll be dead! The same as I experienced nothing before I was born I’ll experience nothing after I die. It’s a scary thought I’m sure but eventually you need to grow up and face reality no matter how much it frightens you. It’s very Christian of you though to want to see me suffering because I don’t agree with you. I’m sure Jesus will love having such a compassionate person at his side when he’s kicking all the African children off his cloud into hell because they weren’t born in the US. Have a nice day, Satan worshiper.

          • Mark

            Don’t put words in my mouth clown! I never said I wanted to see you suffer! Let me tell you something my little speck of dirt, I was not religious all my life. I got saved at the age of 52. When Jesus called me, it was clear as day. I did not seek him. He sought me and I did not turn my back on him. But on the other hand there is you. Every knee shall bow before the savior. How will you answer for your wicked ways?

          • Robert Jory

            My wicked ways only based on your bronze aged supernatural theology. Evil is always different depending where you look at it from. The cat thinks itself righteous as it kills the mouse but the mouse thinks the cat is evil. It’s a shame you were deceived at such a late stage in your life. I truly feel sorry for you. Maybe one day you’ll open your eyes to the truth.

          • Mark

            Son, my eyes have been open to the truth. It’s yours that are being blinded. And I was not deceived, I was saved. It’s you I will pray for. Don’t feel sorry for me. I know where I’m going when I die!

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Delusional is no way to go through life. Interesting, I imagine, but pretty damn useless.

          • Mark

            Again, you like to twist things around. I haven’t acknowledged that my whole life has been a lie. Those are your words. See how Al Gore got caught in his lies and deception? Now the global warming scam cannot go forward. The same thing will happen to you and Mr. Silverman.

          • Mark

            The Power Within

            Acts
            1:8

            God’s Spirit works in every believer. He
            does not limit Himself to pastors and missionaries. If you’ve received Jesus
            Christ as your personal Savior, then residing within you is the same great power
            that raised Christ from the dead (Rom 8:11) The Holy Spirit pours His energy
            into creating godly character in all who follow the Lord.

            The fruit of the Spirit is so named because
            it is the character and conduct that the Holy Spirit produces in believers.
            These are qualities that we can’t generate consistently on our own. The most
            powerful message we can give isn’t a testimony or sermon; it is the life we live
            when the pressure is on, temptation is tremendous, or we are buried under an
            avalanche of problems.

            What the world most needs to see in this
            modern culture is godly families loving one another, business people working
            with integrity and frugality, and young men and women who choose moral purity.
            In a word, the world needs to be exposed to believers who are obedient.

            By showing peace instead of anxiety or
            practicing patience rather than speaking a sharp word, a Christian bears witness
            to the beauty of the gospel. We attract unbelievers to Christ through our words
            and deeds. They may turn down a doctrine, but they cannot ignore a righteous
            life.

            The strongest gospel message does not come
            from a pulpit. The most powerful witness for Jesus Christ where you work, where
            you live, and where you relax is you.
            Submit to the Holy Spirit’s work, and He will produce a great harvest of
            spiritual fruit in your life.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Cripple Fight!
            - South Park 5:2

          • Graham

            How has he suddenly become a satan worshiper?
            I fail to see your logic.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Wait, I thought it was satin worshiper.

            I need a new manual.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Dead is dead. There will be no asking questions or talking of any kind.

          • Mark

            Our Righteousness

            Ephesians
            2:1-10

            Anyone who thinks of himself as a pretty
            good person ought to take a look at God’s assessment of humanity. He says we all
            come into the world spiritually dead and are ruled by Satan, his world system,
            and our own sin nature, or flesh. In the Lord’s eyes, we are children of wrath
            who deserve only punishment.

            On the other hand, God is so pure and holy
            that He is totally separated from all sin and cannot look upon it with any favor
            or approval (Hab.
            1:13). Everything He does is appropriate and beneficial; by
            comparison, even mankind’s righteous acts are like filthy rags (Isa.
            64:6). Yet even though we have nothing of value to offer Him, the
            Lord wants us for His own and has done everything necessary to draw us
            close.

            Those of us who have placed faith in Jesus
            Christ have been made spiritually alive in Him, and all our sins have been
            forgiven. There’s a striking contrast between what we were and who we now are in
            the Lord. But this change has nothing to do with how good we’ve been. Even the
            faith with which we respond to the Savior comes from God. We can never make
            ourselves righteous; it’s all a gift from Him. And once He declares us
            justified, we will never be pronounced guilty again.

            God has said that in the ages to come, He
            wants to show the “surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us” (Eph.
            2:7). For all eternity, we will be showered with this awesome demonstration of
            His love. As great as our blessings are now, they’ll pale in comparison to what
            awaits us in heaven.

          • Wm.Russ Martin

            Cripple Fight!
            - South Park 5:2

          • Graham
        • Wm.Russ Martin

          January – December are better without imaginary beings.

          Does that help clear things up?

          No gods, no messiahs, no truth in myths.
          Eat what you want on any day of any month. Wear clothing of mixed fabrics. Have a roast beef and cheese with a side of shrimp on Friday!

      • jb

        You are an idiot to believe in atheism… does that roll off easy? Your life is a myth… is that better for you? You OBVIOUSLY have an agenda, as does AA and other extremist, anti-religious freedom, anti-God organizations do. Matt was totally right in calling out a blatant hate-mongering attack on the religious beliefs for Americans. AA should be added to the list of hate groups, as they certainly promote attacks on Christians (especially). You are a fool to equate the Christian virtue of ‘turning the other cheek’ to “Yea, that’s why it’s OK for me to slap you”… attitude. You must be radically deceived, unwell, or simply a jerk who knows exactly what they are doing.

        • Robert Jory

          It does roll off easy because you’re just throwing wild punches now. I don’t believe in atheism. I just don’t believe in god. You say atheism like it’s some kind of religion when it is solely the rejection to the belief in a god. I will admit to you that I am anti-theist. Religion is a cancer and one day will be literature only like Roman and Greek mythology. But not all people who don’t believe in gods are the same as me. I look at the facts of reality and they point me in a different direction than a cult of human sacrifice. If that gets your panties in a bunch that’s not my fault. If I come off as a jerk let me refer you to a Tim Minchin quote.

      • BemusedAtheist

        As opposed to a raging atheist fighting for his beliefs? You don’t realise it but you’re acting like a cult member. A proper atheist is non judgemental. In a strange way, christians are more acceptable to live with than a raging asshole who tries to strip everyone of everything that makes them happy.

        If you are an atheist, then act with dignity, because it is clear you’re just another sad hater. Anyone who reads Robert Jory’s comments here in this comments section can see how much pent-up hate he has. I for one will enjoy being friends with people of all beliefs or non-beliefs and celebrate diversity and difference, because it’s diversity and difference that allows evolution to prosper.

        • Robert Jory

          I’m not raging on here, just giving my honest opinion. Glad you take my opinion so highly though since you seem to critique it so carefully. Thank you also for reading all of my comments. Much appreciated. I guess it’s a good thing that you aren’t a woman or homosexual because those Christians you would like to hang out with will not accept you. Again like your other comment about being a proper atheist there are no set rules or regulations on not believing in a god. You think a bit too highly of yourself to be setting a standard of non belief. I agree though that diversity and differences are a good thing. Just not in what people believe is reality especially if those people can create laws based on those falsities they follow. If religion affected no one but the person that believed it I would have no problem with it but they teach it as fact to their children and used it as a tool to preach their god’s hate for certain groups of people. That is what makes me against religion and am glad that one day they will be gone. Good day.

      • mary

        That’s just sociopathic.

      • yosemitedave

        So why not let other people believe what they want to and let it roll of your back then? Why does it concern you enough that you have to go rattle them? It just gives atheist a bad name. And it’s total bs that Atheist can’t enjoy Christmas because of the religious component. I’ve been an Atheist since I was like 10 and it’s never bothered me to have people celebrate Jesus’s birth during Christmas because it’s like a nice fairy tale. The fact is that no one can make you believe if you don’t believe and no one can make you celebrate Christmas as a religious holiday if you don’t want to. The oppressed are in you imagination.

      • Ethan

        Not at all. It’s because we Love Christ! And this message is saying, oh the person you love most. We hate him.
        And that’s all it’s saying. You’d be mad too if you believed.

        • Robert Jory

          No one hates Jesus except maybe some Christians that think Jesus has some plan for their life and it’s turning out to be shit. Most atheists don’t believe in Jesus. I don’t hate the boogy man. He’s not real. If you love imaginary people that’s fine. Some people really love move characters. This billboard is just saying Christmas has nothing to do with Jesus. It’s about time with family and friends, sharing good food, giving gifts, singing annoying Christmas songs and watching A Christmas Story marathons for the millionth time. Most of the traditions of Christmas are pagan in origin and the Catholic church copied them. No hate, just truth.

    • Luke

      Matt,
      I am a die-hard Roman Catholic, and your kind words have very much heartened me. You are the kind of person I want to have a civilized discussion with.

      With all respect, may God bless you.

      • Wm.Russ Martin

        Which god?

    • Julie

      I feel the same way. I want to respect everyone’s beliefs even if I don’t share them.

      • Robert Jory

        I would respect them if they didn’t do so much harm. Rapists are people too but that doesn’t make me want to respect them.

    • marahnatha

      I agree. I have friends that are atheists and some of other faiths as well. It’s good to be able to share thoughts with all of them freely so even if we disagree, we all know where we’re coming from.

    • johnjohnson

      Thank you for your kind comment. I find it amazing – how much controversy comes from the name of Christ…makes one wonder why? What is it about that name that requires a billboard to slander the name?

    • johnjohnson

      I appreciate your comment. I wish more people were like you that has respect for other’s beliefs. However, life is complicated, beliefs are questioned and lots of questions are unanswered…

    • Andrew

      Personally i hate the phrase “As a ___” or “I am ___” quite frankly your opinion on this matter is independent of your religious beliefs or lack thereof. I would agree with your point if the billboard only included the first bit, but the overall message isn’t actually anti-religious. All it’s saying is that instead of focusing on one dude from 2000, spend your holiday season with your family having fun and helping others.

    • John Caramanica

      How is it disrespectful? How come it’s okay for Christians to post whatever they want but then as soon as an Atheist puts out their belief all of a sudden it’s wrong? No one says anything when Christians go around and say “whomever doesn’t believe in Jesus Christ will be judged and sent to hell.” and that’s considered okay?

  • US_Citizen

    I love the billboard. It covers about every subject I have been accused of participating in as an atheist. From being told that I should not celebrate christmas because I am an atheist, that I could not possibly have any understanding of morality and even that I was not capable of loving another. For this reason alone I hold this billboard to the highest regard as it tells those religious people that we atheist indeed share in their festivities, just without their christ being a participating member. Another important function of this billboard is too remind atheist that feel alone in their non-belief that they aren’t alone at all. It is vital to bring this message public as it brings about a sense of social belonging. Thank you American Atheists!

    • marahnatha

      On one hand, you guys love to laud that you are such individuals, lone rangers, free thinkers! Then you say it’s “important” to have social belonging! Huh. By the way, I like the billboard too, for totally different reasons.

      • US_Citizen

        I am not following you (how ironic).
        ———————————–
        Individual, yes.
        Lone ranger, kind of (It certainly can feel this way amongst a large religious population and where being an atheist is frowned upon).
        Free thinker, absolutely yes (I am not told what to think but, rather what I feel is valid to think).

        Per Google (Wordage + Meaning):
        ———————————–
        Individual: a single human being as distinct from a group, class, or family.
        Free Thinker: a person who rejects accepted opinions, esp. those concerning religious belief.
        Lone Ranger: The fictional character, Lone Ranger, is a masked former Texas Ranger who fights injustice in the American Old West with his Indian friend, Tonto. This character has become an enduring icon of American culture. …

        Yes, of course it is important to have a social belonging. Question to you is; Do you seriously believe that the only social circle available happens to embody only religious dogma? I happened to be involved in many social circles; Tech minded, Gardening club, Horse clubs, hiking clubs, traveling clubs and atheist clubs. None of which are religious oriented. If there was a great big sign about any of my social belongings I would state the same; I love it!

    • 3rdjerseyman

      I don’t get it. Why would you celebrate Christmas? Social belonging? Join the Elks or buy a Harley. I tell you this is a very odd phenomenon.

      • US_Citizen

        Because I grew up celebrating the holiday. Christmas tree, dinner with family and friends, sharing gifts, sitting by the fireplace, singing, watching children play with their gifts, much much more…

        Besides, Christmas is more of a secular holiday than a religious one. Unless of course, you spend it at church and or think about religious things during this time. Also, my favorite christmas song is the little drummer boy and Rudolph the red nose reindeer. Which is also perfectly OK.

        I have a friend whom isn’t Jewish but loves Jewish decorations. She has them all over her house, LOL.

        • 3rdjerseyman

          Well, of course I wish you a Merry Christmas, and being an old New Yorker, I had plenty of Jewish pals whose families “knew how to keep Christmas” as Dickens would say, but, I still don’t see why anyone in their right mind would expend any effort to argue against the centrality of the story of the Christ Child to the Christmas holiday. The billboard looks like monumental rudeness to me.

          • US_Citizen

            It is quite simple and to be frank I am actually quite surprised you can’t wrap your mind around it. That is, sure christians celebrate christmas. OK. So do many other people outside of the christian religion. For some it is customary, for others it is a pleasantry… Christmas is a holiday and in no way owned by christians. Sure christians adopted the date for their celebration around the early-to-mid 4th century. Though prior to that date it was customary to celebrate winter solstice. Ironically, the christians are absolutely clueless as to when this christ child was born, guess where he was born and can’t prove his existence. Yet, they have the tenacity to tell others that they can’t celebrate a holiday because it impedes their beliefs. Exactly what platform of belief are we talking about. Are you even grounded or sure of what you believe? Please.

    • 3rdjerseyman

      Dostoyevsky said “without God, everything is possible.” What do you think he meant by that?
      As atheists consider themselves intellectuals, I can only refer you to the irrefutable logic of Pascal’s theorem.

      • US_Citizen

        I can’t speak for Dostoyevsky. So I will answer as if I made the statement.
        For me, I would be implying that having a belief in a god makes it impossible to be within this centuries knowledge base. Most battles for modern medicine, equality, education are due to the religious dragging their feet into this century. They have allowed iron age thought within their holy book to devour their intellect and most have become incapable of utilizing proper reasoning skills. The black and white print is there, in that one can read the results of studies done within multiple countries where the U.S. scores lower than some third world countries. A majority of our classrooms in the U.S. can’t even teach evolution even though it is absolutely fact. In contrast, there was a time that the middle east was the leader. Algebra, medicine… all branched from the middle east. Than came this religious dude and told them it was satans work. So the country went stupid. The U.S. is heading in that direction due to all these religious fanatics. So yes, I would have to say; that (everything) is possible (without god).

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  • Leave each to his own

    Regardless of who celebrates what on what
    dates and during December before Christ was born, or on what date he was
    actually born which cannot seem to be documented, the reality is that
    we celebrate his birth on Christmas, hence the name. American Atheists
    want to celebrate December 25 for a different reason, the exchange of
    presents or whatever should create their own name for
    their celebration and leave
    the Christian celebration named Christmas alone. The Jewish and other faiths have their
    own holidays; they do not intefere with the Christian celebration of Christmas and vice versa.

  • Kay

    Since Christmas has *everything* to do with Christ, your billboard is out of place and only serves to enflame the already over the top religious fanatics that claim that there’s a war on Christmas. I agree with them….but as a Christian it is my belief that the “war” is the secularization and commercialization of the holiday.

    • Mark

      Amen to that! I say let the atheist shut down Christmas. Maybe we can get back to the real reason we celebrate it. But no matter how much they cry fowl, the big retail industry will never let Christmas shut down. The loss of income would kill them!

      • Robert Jory

        That’s true. Christmas these days is more about family togetherness and giving gifts. It has almost nothing to do with Jesus. A lot of the traditions and practices of Christmas are pagan and were done long before the birth of your “christ”.

        • 3rdjerseyman

          Sure, and if there was no Christ we’d all be on for the Saturnalia.

          • Robert Jory

            Christmas… Saturnalia… only difference is the name.

          • 3rdjerseyman

            If there were no Christ there’s be no Christmas. Maybe some nice New Year’s parties, but no Christmas. Your historical analysis is an example of ex-post facto reasoning. You do not denigrate Christmas because of it subsumation of Roman holidays, you denigrate Christianity and seek evidence to support your disdain in shreds of historical obscuritanism.

          • Robert Jory

            Historians do not agree whether there even was a Jesus in biblical times. So it is possible there never was a Christ but if there was a Jesus he was just a delusional hippy. If you believe silly things I’m going to criticize them. You have the right to believe whatever made up stories you want but you do not have the right to not be offended. If you or anyone else is offended when someone makes fun of your fairy tales and their origin that is your problem.

          • 3rdjerseyman

            A) You are incorrect regarding the mere fact of Jesus’ existence.
            B) Here you go with the oddness of your behavior. What compels you to critique anyone’s beliefs? Your aggression is based on some sort of pathology on your part. It is not a normal reaction to someone else’s “made up stories” for you to intrude yourself. It is obviously a compulsion based on an internal, not an external, stimulus.
            C) Of course I have no right to not be offended. However, if you make the choice to offend, you have no right, nor expectation, to escape reaction. To the degree you make yourself offensive you should expect to be chastised.

            So then, why would a mature, reasonable person, who presents themselves as a devotee of reason, chose to be offensive?

          • Robert Jory

            Whether Jesus was a real person or not is not something I declare, it’s historians who say he is or not. Some say he was a person and others say there is no record other than the bible.
            To judge is human nature. If someone wants to know more about they ask what movies, music, activities you like. In order to like something you have to judge it enjoyable or not. When you look at someone you judge them in your mind even if you don’t think you are. It’s psychology, look it up.
            I have no problem with you chastising me based on your opinion. That doesn’t bother me in the least. Just know that if you claim anything from the bible to be true that you’re most likely wrong. That may make me sound like an asshole but being wrong makes people lash out. Sorry.
            Part of being a person of reason is ridiculing the ridiculous. Religion claims a lot of ridiculous things. Reason and logic tells me they are wrong so I voice my opinion. Don’t get your panties in a bunch because you don’t agree.

          • 3rdjerseyman

            Lack of self-knowledge is the saddest ignorance. Why would anyone spend good money to erect a billboard as cited above? What is the point of your “critique” of Christianity? Are you so dull as to not ask yourself why you are possessed of to engage in this tedious enterprise?

          • Robert Jory

            It is tedious arguing with delusional people but it’s sometimes just fun to watch their responses. People will make up whatever they can to fit their argument.

          • 3rdjerseyman

            As mentioned above.

    • Robert Jory

      Christmas has almost nothing to do with Jesus. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rLjHAzqqOm0

      • 3rdjerseyman

        Go tell it to Bach, Handel or the Radio City Christmas show. It is so silly to believe you bought the x-ray glasses and now you see through walls.

        • Robert Jory

          I’m guessing you didn’t watch the video. That or facts just go in one ear and out the other.

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  • UPDATED

    Put up a big board saying that about Islam! You wont! Because you are a coward, Its easy to be a bully to a religion that wont fight back, So be a big man and do it to Islam, Come on big man do it on there big day umm!

    • Dave Muscato

      First of all, you don’t have to say it three times. Second of all, we have put up boards before attacking Islam. It has nothing to do with cowardice. It’s December, man. What did you think we were going to do?

    • Julie

      Maybe in August during their religious holiday, you just might see the sign, but not in December!

  • UPDATED

    Put up a big board saying that about Islam! You wont! Because you are a coward, Its easy to be a bully to a religion that wont fight back, So be a big man and do it to Islam!!!!! Com on man I DARE YOU!

  • UPDATED

    And put up a board saying you don’t need
    muhammad the prophet in Islam! Do it Chicken $h!t!!!

    • Mark

      Agreed! They know if they did that, they would be hunted down like the dogs they are!

      • Robert Jory

        Ever heard of ad hominem? It’s one of the logical fallacies that people use in debates. It means do not attack someone’s character, but the argument. Calling us dogs weakens your stance.

        • 3rdjerseyman

          The point remains valid. You dare not insult the Prophet. You are picking on the little kids and old ladies who still love the baby Jesus. If you are at war with the harm done humanity by belief in the supernatural, Islam should be your obvious target. You natter on about the Inquisition, but haven’t the guts to call out the Jihadis working their magic today.

          • Robert Jory

            Are you Islamic? No? Okay then I don’t need to call out Islam as none of you believe it and it would be pointless. How Christian of you to try to create a scapegoat, though. Islam claims to be a religion of peace when it causes hate and harms other human beings. They are taught that anyone not belonging to their religion is an infidel and should die. It’s not only true for Islamic countries either. The Muslim community in Great Britain believe anyone who speaks out against the Prophet should be arrested and punished. Are Christians going to stoop to their low about Jesus?

          • 3rdjerseyman

            Is this your idea of logic? The point stands unrefuted. You are, in essence bullies, and bullies are usually cowards. If there is a religious holiday in the world that is redolent of peace and joy it is Christmas. Forget the supernatural, the idea that the incarnation of the all powerful is the most helpless; that the infinite is incarnated in that most mortal of creatures; that the unknowable chose to share the existence we all know, is powerful and inspiring with or without the existence of a deity.
            Your rude insult to the people who cherish and celebrate that holiday stands in stark contrast to your pusillanimous failure to address the murderous and oppressive religious fanaticism splashed across the front page of the daily papers everywhere everyday. If there is merit to your campaign: if there is damage being done by religion- damage that must be resisted- that damage’s most obvious manifestation is not the myth of the Manger, but the thousands murdered monthly in th ename of the Prophet. When are you going to do something about that?

          • Robert Jory

            Let’s see what religion has done for us in one month time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gl-q8dARtDQ

            Christmas is a time for family and gift giving. That’s it. Christians even admit it has nothing to do with Jesus’s birthday since historians tells us he wouldn’t have been born anywhere near the winter solstice. But then again arguing with a Christian is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter how good I am at chess the pigeon will just knock the pieces down, crap on the board and strut around victoriously.

          • Rob_Drury

            I know of no Christians who believe that Christ was literally born on December 25th, nor any who believe the date to have any relevance whatsoever. Christmas is, however, solely a celebration of Christ’s birth and, more importantly, of the significance of his life on Earth and the ramifications of it. I can agree with your stance that Christmas has nothing to do with religion, but then, neither does Christ.

          • Robert Jory

            Christmas is about family and gift giving. It has nothing to do with Jesus or Christ, other than its name.

          • Rob_Drury

            So, apparently we agree; without Christ, Christmas has no particular significance. I can, and do, give gifts to my family anytime I wish.

          • Cthulhu21

            I’ve read stories about how pro-life advocates shoot and kill abortion doctors and sett fire to the clinics. One story I’ve read was about a Reverend named Paul Hill murdering Dr. John Britton and his bodyguard outside his clinic in Pensacola on July 29 1994. He and others like him committed similar acts because of their belief that abortion is murder (stemming of course from their religious beliefs). There are some very frightening religious people out there other than so-called Islamic extremists. (If you already knew about this I’m sorry for restating it to you)

          • Robert Jory

            Of course I know that. Just look at the West Boro Baptist people. They have children on the streets with signs saying “god hates fags” “god loves dead soldiers”. Indoctrination at it’s worst. All religion, except maybe Buddhism and Jainism, make me sick.

          • Cthulhu21

            Sorry again.

          • Rob_Drury

            There are many (likely numbering in the millions) of prolife atheists and agnostics. They, like people of faith, simply define murder as the intentional termination of human life, which a fetus most certainly is.

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  • Jcat

    I triple dog dare you to run ads like the one’s instructing us to leave Christ out of Christmas telling Muslims to give up Allah. Oh please do that. I would really love to see that. Cowards.

  • Fred Park

    Interesting how you want to ignore history to get your own selfish way.

    To worship and study, members of church members got together in large groups.

    The gathering was called a Mass.

    Once a year, there was one special Mass to celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ.

    This became known as the CHRIST MASS., or Christmas.

    GO GET YOUR OWN HOLIDAY AND LEAVE OURS ALONE.

    Build yourself up instead of tearing us down.

    • Eric Martin

      This was the BEST statement of ignorance Ive seen in a long time! Sir, you cracked me up! “Interesting how you want to ignore history to get your own selfish way” I say that to xians all of the time. The buy-bull is nothing but a collection of stolen and butchered myths. KNOW YOUR HISTORY and you too will see the bullshit that is claimed as original christianity. Xmas was a regurgitation of local myths to assimilate people and get them to believe in their god. I could go on but this isnt H.S. history class.

      • George

        You may want to take your own advice and do the research yourself instead of buying into what your biased professors indoctrinated you at school with.

        Christianity is based on the God inspired writings of 40 authors over 1,500 years that delivered a consistent message that never contradicts itself. It also has hundreds of prophecies that predict the coming of Christ from Genesis to Malachi.

      • 3rdjerseyman

        Cliff notes version of the received wisdom.

  • JQuincy

    Hmm. How did the holiday eason come about? Maybe that’s why it’s called Christmas.

  • Imogen Ation

    So can you. At least the billboard doesnt come knock on your door just as you get your baby down for a nap or tell your kids they will burn in hell for eternity.

  • Imogen Ation

    Or murder people in the name of a nonexistent jealouse angry mythical being. Or commit infanticide.

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  • Canadensis

    With your continued rant about Christianity having nothing to do with Christmas, you’ve lowered yourselves to the same level as Muslims. Muslims are malignant, Christian are benign and with one stroke of the brush, your group lowered yourselves to the same level as desert barbarians. Christianity today, for the most part, hurts no one. Islam kills people. You’d be better served to rant against Islam. If Islam wins the war they have launched on America, even atheists like you will be begging for their lives as they are made to convert to Islam…or die.

  • Canadensis

    I don’t know what all the fuss is about. Words can’t hurt. In this land we are free to express ourselves. If Christians don’t like the billboard, don’t look at it. If Christians don’t like the billboard, don’t give it any press by acknowledging it. If Christians don’t like the billboard, rent a nearby billboard and tell your side of the story. But for heaven’s sake, turn the other cheek, love thy neighbour and the rest will take care of itself.

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  • Gerardo

    There is not such thing as Atheist because you believe you are your own god , the one the rules your life , so if you suck as human being less you could make it as a god from a very loving point of view .

  • Rembo

    Fairly sophomoric, unsophisticated marketing approach with amateurish graphics. The message is o.k., but a very combative and arguable theme that is only trying to score low points with the viewing public. Very few people are going to feel all warm and cuddly over the commercial dreck that has a stranglehold on America for the month of December. Is all that crap what atheists are fighting to preserve? I don’t think so (and I certainly hope not!). A hot topic like this needs a polished advertising and marketing plan vetted by creative and experienced professionals. AA can do better than this, methinks.

  • Fred Park

    I have been looking for a place for someone to tell me what an atheist is and all I find are definition that say what you are not. Is there a definition for atheist that describes what you are without comparing yourselves to a “person of faith”?

    • Julie

      You will never find that answer because we are all individuals who do not believe in God. That is our sole common thread.

      • George

        In other words, a bunch of fools that BELIEVE that we all came from nothing.

      • Fred Park

        Julie, Thank- you for being honest that you, as a group, are against something instead of being for something. You are members of an ungroup.

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  • Mandy DivineChaos Andersonn

    Lmfao. Seriously? Christians are on here arguing that it’s called “Christmas” for a reason? Uh yeah, because Christians stole the damn holiday and slapped their own name on it. So please, take your own advice and “get your own holiday”. That’s absolutely priceless.

    As for all the whining about how mean and nasty a bit of snark is? Well, I guess that would depend on what we’re comparing it to. Should we compare it to the treatment meted out to atheists, pagans, and those who believed in adifferent brand of Christianity over the fucking centuries by Christians in power? Yeah, I didn’t think so. Get over it.

    • marahnatha

      Thanks for bringing the debate into the sewer.

    • Graham

      Despite its origins, christmas is now supposed to be the celebration of Jesus. The Dec 25 thing is irrelevant. it is just they day we celebrate it on. Like how Presidents Day isn’t on one Presidents birthday

    • 3rdjerseyman

      We certainly do have a toxic culture. Amazing the ugliness within.

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  • FreeIndeed

    I would love for this message to be received by the Believers of Messiah. Christ-mass is a mixture of superstition and Catholicism. It is not Messiah’s birthday and should not be kept as such. The words on this billboard cannot/should not ruffle feathers of Christians who desire to please Him, rather than man and his traditions.

    • marahnatha

      There isn’t anything wrong with traditions. They unite us as a people, but know the difference between tradition & religious instruction. We don’t care about the billboard. OK? And we will celebrate the coming of our Messiah just as the Jews remember Passover and other feasts that God instituted.

  • letitrainmom

    What a bunch of scared, sad, angry, miserable, intolerant people. It is actually kind of funny and sad that they would spend money on billboards to spread their “hate”. Why don’t they use their money to help the homeless or vets. No they use their money to spread hate and anger. Boy I would I was as free thinking and intellectual as they are. LOL.

  • George

    It’s about time that atheists display in full view what most are all about… a bitter bunch that would try to deny joyful believers their time of celebration. Why not start a new holiday tradition to celebrate the nothing that you believe brought about everything and see how many people join you? Silly rabbits… tricks are for kids.

  • Jill_Calkins

    Even as you deny His reality, you affirm it. Thank you for spreading the Word.

    Php 1:15 Some indeed preach Christ even of envy and strife; and some also of good will:
    Php 1:16 The one preach Christ of contention, not sincerely, supposing to add affliction to my bonds:
    Php 1:17 But the other of love, knowing that I am set for the defence of the gospel.
    Php
    1:18 What then? notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretence, or in
    truth, Christ is preached; and I therein do rejoice, yea, and will
    rejoice.

  • TrayvonThug

    I disagree, Matt. I think we should be aggressive and push back the inevitable theist mud-slinging and name calling.

    • marahnatha

      Go for it. Put up more billboards. Hows the knockout game going? We may be embarrassed by Aunt Mildred or Uncle Ned who tips the sauce a little on holidays, but atheists have even stranger bedfellows. And they let all the cats out of the bag.

  • marahnatha

    What do they think a “holi-day” is? It’s a Holy-Day, set apart to God. He instituted memorials and remembrances to be passed down through the generations to keep us mindful of things He brought us through or of important events that are meaningful to us.

  • Donna S.

    …and NO ONE needs Atheists. Christ is the reason for the season. I don’t celebrate any other’s religion and I don’t tell them they can’t celebrate what they want. Keep your nose out of our business and we’ll stay out of you non believers.. You have nothing to celebrate. Stop infringing on our holiday. If you don’t like it, work on Dec 25 and Dec 24 eve. It wasn’t until much, much later that Christmas has grown into a money maker by greedy B’s like atheists. All you atheists keep working on our holiday and if we need anything from you,
    we’ll call.

  • cld

    On behalf of my Christian family may I sincerely wish Atheists everywhere a blessed and happy holiday season.

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  • Graham

    I have no problem with atheists, they believe what they believe, i believe what i believe, i just hate it when Anybody, an Atheist or a fellow Christian, gets butthurt and angry when the other does not agree. If the person you are talking about your belief to does not agree, their loss, you tried to change their mind and you failed. Just move on and hope that they might change their mind to what is right.

    • Robert Jory

      It’s not that atheists get angry because religious people don’t agree, it’s that they push their beliefs down the throats of their children and claim it truth when there is no reason to believe it other than a really old book.

  • KP

    As a Christian, I find it amusing that the very people who bash Christianity have never opened the Bible so they take what the “so-called” educated people teach in our classrooms and run with it. People are quick to judge and condemn Jesus Christ who stood for everything that’s good. He healed the sick and worked many miracles which promoted a message of peace and love. Yet, everyone condemns Him and continues to hate Him thousands of years later. Just like the Jews who put Jesus to death a couple of thousand years ago, there’s still an un-found hatred for Jesus that I still can’t fathom. Christ affords everyone the ability to think and choose whether or not to believe in Him. Only a God who hates people would force everyone to believe. What makes the world so great is that we have the choice to be an atheist or a Christian. We can all live in harmony and respectfully agree to disagree with one another. Atheists should be able to have their billboards just like us Christians should be able to place a Cross in the middle of a town/city common. Since a billboard denouncing Christ is offensive to us believers, then it should be fair game that we be allowed to promote Christ as we see fit. Let’s face it, we both have agendas. Atheists wish to rid my God from the world and I wish to promote Him every way possible. Again, we need to agree to disagree with each other, but do it lovingly.

    • Robert Jory

      Sadly the people against Christianity have read more of the bible than actual Christians. When I bring up contradictions in the bible Christians don’t believe me because they’ve never read the passages I quote. If I mention Elisha being insulted by children calling him ‘baldhead’ he curses them in the name of god and two bears kill 42 children they don’t believe me. 2 Kings 2;23-24. How someone can worship and practice the teachings of a book they have not read cover to cover is beyond me.

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  • jb

    Free thought? And then we get “You don’t need Christ”, blah blah. What a joke AA is. Same hypocritical liberal behavior. We can attack you, but if you SAY anything about it, then YOU are the hate-monger. Sadly these liars are very effective with propaganda and twisting the truth into lies. Repent, get saved, so you can go to Heaven and live with God forever.

    If you follow atheist teaching, your life will be SO much better, and then you’ll go to Hell forever cut off from God. Sounds like a BAD deal to me.

  • 3rdjerseyman

    Isn’t this odd, not to say obsessive behavior? Why would anyone spend the money and go through the trouble to insult the feelings of people who, understandably enough, consider Christmas to be the celebration of the birth of Jesus? What is the point, and doesn’t it seem at a minimum bad manners and possibly reaching to a psychological problem?

    If I love chocolate, I spend no time at all picking on people who live vanilla. Is this to be regarded as some sort of sporting competition, and this is a rabid Red Sox fan’s “Yankees Suck” billboard in Times Square ( which, incidentally, I don’t believe would be installed. You will recall what happened to the anti-abortion billboard a few years ago.)
    Seems like the Grinch is back.

  • 8DX

    Great message. Horrible design. And I mean HORRIBLE. Why does AA almost always totally fail on this front? Why not just stick to the relatively ok blue-sky-and-clouds designs of past atheist billboards?

    This sticks out like a sore thumb, like a bad flash advert.

    Yes – Christmas is not really about Jesus any more, and adding any religious figure to human festivities is not helpful, so spot on with the message. But. Get. A. Decent. Design. Person!

  • BemusedAtheist

    Atheists live and let live, and are happy, but this message is decidedly anti-christ (literally, for whatever dramatic reason).

    I’m quite sure that a true atheist has no issues with christ or christmas, and is happy living in a world where anyone can choose to follow their own beliefs. This website seems so full of hate and non-tolerance that it is absurd, and frankly bordering on the cultish.

  • Yamatranzy

    I’m and atheist and I found this really funny, although I think American Atheists could go through some alternate, less instigating methods. When someone insults me because I think something came from nothing, I get a little angry. I don’t think insulting people’s religion is the best way to go. We could just say something like, “Happy Holidays” with the American Atheists logo on it, large and easily read. Personally I have a feeling that a lot of people are getting the wrong idea about us; that we really are antagonizing, insulting, rude, proud, and sometimes even intolerant. Maybe instead of rudely making fun of people’s religions (people don’t usually join a group that has insulted them) we should approach this in a more passive manner. Treat it as a delicate situation, and act like mature human beings instead of stooping to these levels. Because then, maybe, people won’t view us a satanic child-sacrificing demons but rather as fellow human beings that have some interesting ideas.

  • Gary

    My thoughts are that the real downside to this is that you play right into the “war on christmas” loons. To quote something I recently read on this billboard “…you might’ve heard Roger Ailes shout, ‘Hook, line and sinker!” You have given FoxNews the credibility they do not deserve!

  • Laura

    To me it just demonstrates the power of Christ. They went through all that trouble and money just to dismiss him. Lol Jesus is the way the truth and the life.

  • brian

    I respect those who don’t believe in God. I once was a non believer. I don’t want people to believe just to believe, however, when Christ said, “I stand at the door and knock, anyone who opens the door, I will come in and dine with him”, he meant it. I invited the one I didn’t believe in to come in and he did. If you want Jesus to come into your life he will. He promises he will.

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  • Jonathan

    I do agree with Matt. It’s not convincing anyone to become an atheist. It doesn’t really have a point. I think that they could of spent the money they did on that prime advertising space for the Philippines relief fund.

  • johnjohnson

    Dear Atheists…I challenge you to look up the work Holiday and the origin of that word. If you want to be true to your Atheism around Christmas – just say Seasons Greetings…can’t find any religious tones about that one.

  • j nelson

    JESUS–the WONDERFUL ONE…He is greater than any ruler…mightier than any warrior…nobler than any king…wiser than any sage…bigger than any kingdom…better than any crown…lovelier than any name…worthy of worship…deserving of praise. Wishing you more of Him this Christmas and in the coming year. No wish could be higher… no desire more sincere…no goal more rewarding…God Bless You All…

  • Ralph J Sugar

    Please Atheists , live your live as you wish–But you 2%ers should stop your Stupid war on people of faith- Do . believe what ever you wish- do it in your own backyards- and leave those of us alone- We wish you happiness doing what ever you want to do- Worshio as you wish, the sun, moon, dirt, leaves, dogs, what ever!!! And GOD Bless you guys—

    • johnjohnson

      Dear Ralph, this was a condescending message that you wrote. We have the right and freedom to believe anything we want. I believe in Christmas, but we should always be respectful even to Atheists regardless
      .

      • Ralph J Sugar

        Dear Johnjohnson– Please explain what YOU meanwhen you say “you believe in Christmas”????? You reject Christ! Right? You interfer with “our spirtual Holliday in celebrating the birth of Christ- thats what we do at Christmas time-! You say you believe in Christmas- what do you mean by that-??? I meant NO Condesenshen It is a Christian Holliday and its a day that brings atheist out in droves to mock our beliefs???? Why dont you COWARDS go out among the Islamist and mock Mohammed??? Or Jews during Rosh Hoahana ? Please do what ever turns you guys on–Just find another day to do it on!!!

    • OhioAtheist

      War? I see no guns here.

      • Ralph J Sugar

        The Atheist Leaders that Murdered Millions and MIllions of people, Made SURE that those people who were killed HAD NO GUNS– That was leaders like Mao se Dung, Chow en Lai, Adolh Hitler, Joseph Stalin, Pol Pot and Mussolini– ALL ATHEISTS my “friend”— The leaders were to 2 % ers of those times– Study some History, instead of listening to the Liberal Professors who DO NOT EDUCATE today, THEY INDOCRINATE!!!~!

        • OhioAtheist

          LOL…gotcha. I think you’ve got some revisionist history going on here. And adding all those caps and exclamation points don’t make your points any more true. Keep trying, Ralphie.

          • Ralph J Sugar

            And, what do you 2%ers add to revisionist history? You have a lot of FOLLOWERS right behind you -DONT YOU??? POOR LOST SOULS— Just go worship a rock, praise a tree. mumble out there somewhere- have a good life- I wll continue to laugh and be happy- Bless you !!!

  • A very happy Christian

    I don’t understnd your position at all. I will not condem you for the way you feel either. If you don’t believe in Chistian Religion, ok you don’t believe. The majority of this county are Christian, why does this bother Athiest’s? No person has forced me to believe the way I believe, Christmas does celebrate the birth of the Son of God, His name is Jesus Christ. Iam not forcing this on you at all, you believe or you don’t, I don’t have a problem with that..Why would you bring the attention to your group? Are you that afraid of our position. You can believe the way you want without being condemed for your belief, and Christians can believe in Christianity whatever domination we are. It’s so very sad you would take to the street and post a billboard like that, what are you afraid of???? I do think Christmas is a celebration of Santa Claus for children, you are correct there, but for young adults, and us older adults we believe that Christ, the new born King was born in in a manger. He also died for all the sinners, you included, none of us are without sin, by Christ dying on the cross, He freed us all. If you fell differently, that’s ok, but don’t think we need your permission to believe any other way, we have been given a free, so we choose to believe in Jesus Christ. I wish you a very Happy Holiday, but for me and all the Christian in the county we wsh you a “Very Merry Cristmas”.
    By the way, did you celebrate the holiday when you were a child, tell the truth.
    your permission

  • Ralph J Sugar

    Why dont you guys, “Atheists” establish a day of “worship” for yourselves?? Just pick a DAY and go with it—Heck, take a week if you want, but do it at a dlfferent time than CHRITMAS– I am sure ,that if you 2 % ers got together, you can come up with a great idea– I will bet, doing this will make the other 95% of humans on earth very happy— Maybe it will make you guys happy to= Please, just leave us religious BAD GUYS ALONE!!!

    • OhioAtheist

      For starters, there’s nothing to worship. And we do have a day, it’s called Christmas…you know, the pagan solstice festivals that were co-opted by Christianity? Do you also know that Christmas was outlawed by the church as Pagan/satanic, and did you know that it was also outlawed in the colonies for the same reason? Christmas wasn’t adopted as a US holiday until the 1870s, when Christmas stories became popular.

      • Ralph J Sugar

        You atheist must be the most intelligent people on the planet- You number about 2 % in the USA and about *8 % world wide??? Believe what you will, wish what you want think as you do–Go about your life and do not worship ANYTHING !!!! OK- I guess the 92 % of the humans are just wondering around trying to upset your life-styles — I wish you well , no matter how you think or what you believe–OK God Bless you guys anyway- Please leave us to our way of life- We will certainley ignore your beliefs!!

  • Ralph J Sugar

    That right guys NOBODY NEEDS CHRIST!!!!! You guys tell that to the MANY MILLIONS murdered by the likes of MAO, Adolf Hitler, STALIN,Choe En LAi- Pol-Pot and many other NICE ATEIST leaders in the last hundred years– Goe beless them huh guys– Careful what you wish for!!!!

  • johnjohnson

    I find it amazing – how much controversy comes from the name of Christ…makes one wonder why? What is it about that name that requires a billboard to slander the name?

  • mary

    Hate speech like this is offensive to everyone.Only a coward would put up a sign to their fellow man insulting a holiday at a time of year he holds sacred and dear. Just despicable.

    • johnjohnson

      I wouldn’t call them a coward…just someone trying to prove a point and create some havoc. But in actuality, You can’t X out the truth. No billboard will take Christ out of Christmas. Christmas has been and will always be celebration of Christ birth.

  • blaaa

    You don’t the nerve to attack other religions. You’d never say anything against Muhammad or Allah. I wonder why? You FORCE your belief in nothing on others all of the time. You are using HATE SPEECH.

    • OhioAtheist

      Ummm…no, no, and no. Atheists do speak out about other religions, including Islam. No beliefs are being forced on anyone. And how can you make such a claim, when there are Christian symbols and messages everywhere. There are three times as many churches as schools in the U.S. And one billboard is forcing beliefs, when you have 300,000 churches? You’re kidding, right? And no, it’s not hate speech. Just because something out there contradicts your personal beliefs does not make is hate speech.

  • john johnson

    Funny thing is…you can still see the word Christ on the billboard even with the
    ” X” But if Christ would have been blackened out…the billboard would have made no sense. Now matter how you look at it…you can’t stamp out the truth…Merry Christmas!

  • Dawn

    Dear Atheists.org – I am strong believer in
    the Constitution and of the First Amendment. You are entitled to your
    opinion, and I to mine. You have the right to believe or not believe.
    To celebrate Christmas or not. To celebrate it in a way
    that works for you and your family. You have the right to put this
    billboard in Times Square. It won’t change how I feel or how my family
    celebrates this holiday. But my opinion is that the “nobody” part is
    rude, disrespectful, and untrue. Millions of people around the world
    want and need Christ in Christmas, and I really don’t understand why you
    felt the need to negate my existence. Oh, and I truly hope you have a
    very Merry Christmas. Signed, “Nobody”

    • OhioAtheist

      How exactly is your existence negated? Do you no longer exist?

    • cemetery

      It’s funny how many people don’t understand the difference between ‘want’ and ‘need’. The billboard is stating who NEEDS it..nobody. So let me get this straight…there is someone out there who will immediately perish due to ‘christ’ being taken out of ‘christmas’? No, the problem is that you WANT christ in christmas, in no way, shape, or form do you NEED it. You NEED air, you NEED food, you NEED water, you WANT a new cell phone, you WANT a new tv. Big difference between the two words, one of them you’ll still live, the other you’ll die.

  • Frederick

    1 Corinthians 1:18
    18. For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

    Truth is people who haven’t experienced God grace will never understand, so it is silly to them that we celebrate the birth of Jesus.So to my brothers and sister in Christ (Jesus thee Christ) we should not cast our pearls before swine. If the atheist want to push Jesus out of Christmas and as they put it improve the holiday we (followers of Christ) should let them put up billboards. Why? you may be asking. Because God uses all things to bring Him glory! Even billboards that say we don’t need Him. God doesn’t need our approval. I love when stuff like this happens because it makes me think, read,and study about what I believe. No matter what happens if the country does end up pushing God out of Christmas it wont matter because God is I AM. Humans have been trying for years to push God out every single one has failed. To my atheist brothers and sisters out there don’t worry I pray for you and one day either on this earth or when all of our knees are bowed to God you will understand.

  • Joe Barry Richardson

    What is so strange about the message is it proclaims all the values taught to us by Christ. “Celebrate the true meaning of Xmas and offers a series of cheery words: family, friends, charity, food, snow, and more.”

  • Scott

    Well AA when you’re right you’re right. The typical Christmas Traditions do not exist in Christianity. However the very name Christ Mass, which is the holiday that is celebrated on the 25th of December is the religious gathering of Christians to celebrate the birth of Christ. Honestly we Christians can and should celebrate the birth of Christ on any day of the calendar. One doesn’t have to celebrate their own birthday on the day they they were born, and we don’t have to do that for Christ.

    It really doesn’t matter if you believe in a historical Jesus or not the holiday’s own name states what it is. There are many reasons why things have changed and fewer and fewer people celebrate the holiday as it was originally named. That is something that each of us has to decide on our own.

    If you wish to celebrate December 25th without Christ, then that is your call. I will respect your wishes, but why can’t you respect my wishes to celebrate December 25th with Christ? Why do you have to put up billboards attacking my choices?

    At the end of the day your arguments are all flawed. Christmas is The Christ Mass. You cannot physically have The Christ Mass without Christ, it would just be The Mass. But you do not need Christ to celebrate December 25th.

    Enjoy your December 25th celebrations, I will enjoy my Christmas. May your families be blessed by God so that you and yours may see the truth of God’s love for you.

    I do have one final question for you, where were your billboards denouncing Mohammad and Allah when Ramadan was going on?

    • tasteless chap

      The Muslim community (with equally deplorable religious views) is not the faith community that is trying desperately to force all of America to believe as it does. If and when that happens, I’m sure you’ll see AA putting up billboards regarding such.

  • Aterg

    Thanks to god, I may consider happy Hollidays on my chritmas cards. Merry blessed Christmas to you who know beter.

    • OhioAtheist

      Ummm…what?

  • yosemitedave

    This billboard shows the worse side of Atheists demonstrating that Atheists can persecute others just like believers persecute Atheists. Why can’t we all just get along?

    • OhioAtheist

      What exactly about the billboard constitutes persecution?

  • Shelly Deitz Popp

    I am thoroughly offended by this campaign. What is wrong with allowing anyone to believe in their religion? How does it hurt you atheist? Why is your belief more valid than mine? Where is your tolerance????

    • NorwegianThunder

      Because a person who is a moderate is, in a fundementalststs eyes, nothing but a failed fundementalstst.

      If the religious kept it at home and church there probably wouldn’t be so much fuss. Sadly though many of these people want to control and legislate my world – based on a dangerous set of myths.

      If you would stop indoctrinating children – that would be great too.

      But don’t talk to us about tolerance or morality because your book is bankrupt

      Ps. We don’t beleive – and that determination is because we accept the null hypothesis.

      Evidence is reviewed and we determine whether it is sufficient to allow us to reject the null hypothesis and accept the alternative. Why is the null hypothesis so important? It keeps us intellectually honest.

    • OhioAtheist

      “I am thoroughly offended by this campaign.”

      OK. So what. You don’t have a right to be not offended. I’m offended by constant religious attempts as Constitutional violation of the Establishment Clause. I’m offended by teaching creationism in school, under the guise of science. I’m offended by priests molesting children and the church covering it up. I’m offended by people using a 2,000-year old book to justify giving people not like them (gays) less rights.

      “What is wrong with allowing anyone to believe in their religion?”

      It’s not so much the believing as the deplorable actions of those who believe.

      “How does it hurt you atheist [sic]?”

      It hurts us when you proselytize to our kids. It hurts when you try to force prayer into public schools. It hurts when your priests rape our kids. It hurts when you indoctrinate children, who have no critical thinking abilities to decipher truth from Christian dogma.

      “Why is your belief more valid than mine?”

      Based on an examination of the evidence. Since there is a complete lack of evidence supporting the existence of any gods (let alone, yours), the default position is to reject claims without evidence.

      “Where is your tolerance????”

      I’m tolerant of plenty of things. I tolerate country music. I tolerate fake wrestling. I tolerate people who wear funny clothes. I do NOT tolerate dogma, child rape, indoctrination, and overt violations of the Constitution, which is designed to protect EVERYONE, not just those with a cross hanging from their neck.

      That good enough for ya?

  • Jodie

    As soon as I saw this billboard I began chuckling at the wording that was chosen for it. Christians believe they are children of Christ…not “nobodies.”

  • Ethan

    Not just at Christmas. We people need him all year long!

  • Trina Macko

    How many donations did you guys get since posting that sign in Times Square…? Lucrative was it?

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  • Olivia Salmonsen

    Hey so I’m a Christian but in Greek and ancient scrolls and such X meant Christ. Why did you guys waste money on this? I’m also an accountant and I usually like how athiests spend money better than a church. You guys should have picked a z shaped scribble. Call it ‘Zmas’ the holiday that’s after xmas.
    Or hey, maybe omit the ‘mas’ part as well, since that means ‘mass’ ,and athiests don’t go to mass. Also, who said that all Christians go to church? Because I do not.

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  • JudgeX X

    I’m an atheist, and I’ve been told I don’t belong in this country (By a president, even). I get that the general consensus among Christians is similar. Therefore, pour on the billboards. Let’s make them feel as unwelcome as they make us feel.

  • geri baher

    merry solstice to me, and happy festivus to the rest of us.

  • OhioAtheist

    I find it entirely comical that people complain about this, in a country with 300,000 Christian churches. In a country in which 16% of all American’s identify with no religion, yet ZERO members of Congress identify as such. In a country in which it is illegal for an atheist to hold political office in seven states (all in the south, which comes as no surprise). The Christians have no idea how good they’ve got it. Get over yourselves.

  • DrJ

    This is really offensive and anti- history (read ignorant). And I am an active atheist. I am embarrassed. We should never take this path of offensive ignorance, the very thing we stand against.

  • Matilda

    This billboard is offensive on so many levels. It is disrespectful to people and the holiday. That holiday has been celebrated for centuries and this modern cult calling themselves “American Atheists” is pushing their agenda on public using donated funds. I’d say strip them off of their 501″c”3 status. They don’t know how manage their funding.

    • cemetery

      Oh, you mean like the Winter Solstice which was celebrated long before ‘christmas’ on the 21st of December? You know, before you claim it’s a religious holiday for only one religion, maybe you should do your history checking to make sure you have a right to claim it, which you don’t since it was the pagans’ holiday first :)

  • guest

    I understand the intent behind this billboard, but I think it was poorly executed. The crossing out of ‘Christ’ and replacing it with ‘nobody’ is needlessly provocative. It would have been better to accentuate the positives, show some pictures of atheists having a good time, sharing a meal, opening presents and so on. The graphics aren’t that great either- there are too many words on the board and the different size fonts and colours are distracting.

  • John

    I find it hilarious that this movement spends time and money to prove and promote the idea that there is no God. By simply acknowledging that He needs to be removed from something or somewhere, isn’t that an acknowledgement that He exists. It is a bit like me starting a campaign to remove the monsters from underneath my bed. If I do not believe they exist, why would I spend my time and resources to try to get rid of those said monsters? I would simply go on with my life. I respect Matt for taking a stand against HATE. I will be praying for you all, whether you want it or not.

  • JOHN

    whether you believe in God or not how could you not realize that Jesus is for real and he is the reason for the season and if you think a mindless billboard is going to change that God Bless you. Have a Merry Merry CHRISTMAS!!!

  • Mario Alsdorf

    LOL. 21st century morons believing in bronze age mythology…..where are the Herculeans?

  • Monti

    As a non atheist, I want to help in the cause that atheists believe in, and that is the full separation of Government from any ties to religion. I have drafted a proposal to my senator and house members for Ohio, and in the US House and US Senate. My proposal is that no federal dollars from any source be used to support any religious organization, or affiliation. The largest source of government money to support religious organizations and affiliations is through medical insurance supported by the US and State governments. With this notion, I propose that Medicare, Medicaid, VA and other government subsidized insurances (including those through the ACA) should not be able to be used at hospitals and other health programs which are religious associations. I live in Columbus, OH and that would limit the hospitals available to only a couple, rather than the full set of hospitals in the Columbus Metro Area.
    While I have faith in a higher being, I do believe that the atheist movement should get their way when it comes to where tax dollars go to. I would love to see nothing more than hospitals no longer accepting any government benefit insurance, and have the means to charge any patient with those benefits the uninsured premiums. I am sure that a measure like this would delight more people than the bill boards which are so graciously displayed in removing Christ from Christmas. I also encourage that atheists stay out of religious affiliated hospitals as well, after all you wouldn’t want to be accused of supporting something that you do not believe in.

  • Monti

    I would like to ask if anyone on here would be willing to exchange his or her soul to me? I understand that you do not believe that a soul exists, but I came across a very interesting Occult document that I would like to try out on my spirit board. I promise to be willing to do damning and demeaning things with it. I figure since you don’t believe in something existing that it would be a fairly easy thing to give up. Please reply, and I will print and apply to the spirit board. Thank you, and happy dirt nap.

  • rargos

    Still don’t understand why AA don’t put up billboard insulting Muslims or Jews in Times Square … seems a little dishonest, as there are probably more Jews than Christians in New York City.

    • cemetery

      Because ‘christmas’ is a christian made holiday, not muslim.

  • Daddy Christmas

    Who needs the “Christ” in Christmas.? Celebrate the true meaning of Xmas! Look up what the “X” means in Xmas and you will see how foolish and idiotic, and under educated your billboard message actually is lol

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